2018 Competitor: New Toyota Camry has V6, maybe new Accord too? - Drive Accord Honda Forums
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post #1 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 02:38 PM Thread Starter
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2018 Competitor: New Toyota Camry has V6, maybe new Accord too?

I would have guessed that it was a safe bet that the 2018 Camry and 2018 Accord would drop their V6 engines and move to turbocharged 4 cylinders for MPG purposes. However today I read that the new 2018 Camry is going to keep the V6 option. In my mind, this makes it much more likely that the next generation Accord will too for competitive reasons, right?

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post #2 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 02:53 PM
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post #3 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 03:08 PM
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^^ Agree. A turbocharged 4-banger if done right will curl your hair.

I'll let the members decide whether it will be much of a competitor.

http://www.autoblog.com/2017/01/09/2...oit-auto-show/

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2018 Toyota Camry: Made in America, great again

New style, new engines, new focus on driving dynamics.



Even as SUVs and crossovers are taking a bite out of sedan sales, the Toyota Camry still managed to be the best-selling vehicle in 2016 without a truck bed. Impressive, given that it was in the seventh and final year of its current design. And doubly so considering that it was design that was never exactly at the forefront of style, innovation or, critically, the midsize sedan pack.

Imagine, then, what the all-new 2018 Toyota Camry unveiled here in Detroit may be able to accomplish. It represents a fundamental shift for the Camry, from its obviously bolder styling and its reimagined dimensions, to the way Toyota says it will be more involving behind the wheel.

It is 0.7 of an inch wider, the wheelbase is 2 inches longer, the roof and hood height have been lowered by 1 and 1.6 inches, respectively, and the front and rear hip points have been lowered by a similar amount. The result of those dimensional changes should be a feeling of sitting in the Camry rather than on it. The steering wheel also now telescopes further (applause from the tall folks in the back), and the hood, cowl and dashboard have all been lowered to maintain visibility.



To further bolster those improved dynamics, Toyota stiffened the Camry – something it had already done considerably during the previous generation's substantial mid-cycle refresh for 2015. There's also a new double-wishbone suspension and four-point engine mounts for a reduction in noise, vibration and harshness (good news for those traditional Camryists out there). According to Toyota, driving dynamics were so at the forefront of the new Camry's development that "drivers will notice the dramatic improvements within the first few seconds of driving." We'll just go ahead and consider that a challenge for our inevitable first drive.



The all-new 2018 Camry comes with an equally all-new lineup of powertrains. The vast majority of those you'll see lining the Safeway parking lot will come with a new 2.5-liter naturally aspirated four-cylinder "Dynamic Force Engine." Rather than going the small-displacement turbocharged route, Toyota adopted a longer stroke and higher compression ratio, direct injection, a variable cooling system, and the latest iteration of the brand's Variable Valve-Timing-intelligent Electric (VVT-iE) system. Output specs weren't released, but Toyota promises better power and torque (the current 2.5-liter produces 178 horsepower and 170 pound-feet of torque) along with best-in-class fuel economy. The current leaders in the clubhouse manage 31 mpg combined.



Also new is the 3.5-liter V6, presumably shared with the 2017 Toyota Highlander and Sienna. Both four- and six-cylinder engine options are paired to a new eight-speed automatic transmission. The Camry Hybrid makes its return also featuring the new 2.5-liter four-cylinder along with a revised continuously variable transmission that features a new Sport mode capable of simulating six gears. Selecting Sport mode also increases electric boost and thus acceleration.





One key change to the Hybrid is that its battery pack was relocated from the trunk to underneath the rear seat. This should theoretically improve trunk space and improve driving dynamics by relocating the batteries' ample weight toward the vehicle's center of gravity. Toyota anticipates the Camry will achieve "Prius-like city/highway" fuel economy, which would put it in the ballpark of 54 mpg city and 50 mpg highway.



Toyota promises a more driver-focused cabin design to go along with the aforementioned altered seating positions. The interior can be equipped with Toyota's new "Human Machine Interface" that consists of a 7-inch gauge display, a 10-inch color Head-Up Display and center stack controls that feature the latest Entune 3.0 touchscreen integrated with the HVAC control panel. Entune has been updated with new, more smartphone-like menus and icons, along with a basic navigation app standard. On-board WiFi is also now optional and the available JBL sound system has been upgraded.

All of the 2018 Camry trim levels (which continue to be split between the comfier LE and XLE, and the sportier SE and XSE) come standard with the Toyota Safety Sense suite of accident avoidance technologies. These include forward collision warning with auto-brake and pedestrian detection, lane-departure warning and auto-steering, adaptive cruise control and automatic high beams. The 2018 Toyota Camry arrives in dealers late summer 2017.

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post #4 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 03:16 PM
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I'll let the members decide whether it will be much of a competitor. http://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/09/bu...pgtype=article
Mars makes chocolates for dogs? Wrong article perhaps?

Here http://www.autoblog.com/2017/01/09/2...oit-auto-show/
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post #5 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by vinny68 View Post
I would have guessed that it was a safe bet that the 2018 Camry and 2018 Accord would drop their V6 engines and move to turbocharged 4 cylinders for MPG purposes. However today I read that the new 2018 Camry is going to keep the V6 option. In my mind, this makes it much more likely that the next generation Accord will too for competitive reasons, right?
From the link below.....

"Its [2018 Camry] trio of powerplants are spanking-new, too, including a 3.5-liter D-4S (dual port and direct injection) V-6 and a long-stroke 2.5-liter Dynamic Force I-4, which has a thermal efficiency that can touch 40 percent. The latter also serves as the gasoline partner of the revamped hybrid power unit. Both the V-6 and the I-4 are coupled to eight-speed automatics (replacing the previous six-speed boxes), and the Hybrid SE adds a paddle-shift six-speed simulation. We’re told to expect roughly 10 percent more power and 20 percent better efficiency."

2018 Toyota Camry Prototype Drive Review: Tectonic Shift - Motor Trend

Good move, Toyota.
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post #6 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 03:31 PM
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I'm not convinced the V6 will be gone from the accord lineup. They have it in too many things. If the odyssey went turbo 4 only then I'd agree. Yes that's their van and and truck engine also but watch they keep it around for a nice, smooth and torquey premium alternative.

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post #7 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 03:32 PM
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I like the 2 tone colors. Not a big fan of the body kit. I'd pay to have them remove or alter the side and rear body kit tbh. Red seats look sweet though. I'd wait for an accord release before buying. Also, no android auto or apple carplay. Sucks that Toyota wants to not integrate the 2 platforms.
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post #8 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 03:51 PM
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I'm not convinced the V6 will be gone from the accord lineup. They have it in too many things. If the odyssey went turbo 4 only then I'd agree. Yes that's their van and and truck engine also but watch they keep it around for a nice, smooth and torquey premium alternative.
{bold added}

The 2018 Odyssey keeps the V6 and includes Honda's new 10-speed automatic on the top trim levels. Wouldn't it be nice if this combination were offered on the 2018 Accord as well?

As production of the 10-speed ramps up, it will replace the problem-prone ZF 9-speed.

All-New 2018 Honda Odyssey Offers Quieter Cabin,*10-Speed Transmission » AutoGuide.com News

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post #9 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 04:00 PM
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It will be interesting to see if the new V6 Camry will steal sales from Honda of what could have been a V6 Accord. I know I would much rather have a V6 than a turbo I4. Given the choice of a V6 or a turbo I4, all else being equal, I would not get the I4 even if it's a Honda I4.

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I like the 2 tone colors. Not a big fan of the body kit. I'd pay to have them remove or alter the side and rear body kit tbh. Red seats look sweet though. I'd wait for an accord release before buying. Also, no android auto or apple carplay. Sucks that Toyota wants to not integrate the 2 platforms.
I didn't see in any magazine write up of the new Camry that there would not be car play or android auto. But then I didn't see anywhere where it said there would be. So we will have to see.

I'm not a fan of the front end of the new Camry but on paper the new Camry is far more appealing to me than is the new Accord. The V6 and 8 speed auto would sway me to Camry.

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post #10 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 04:13 PM
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It will be interesting to see if the new V6 Camry will steal sales from Honda of what could have been a V6 Accord. I know I would much rather have a V6 than a turbo I4. Given the choice of a V6 or a turbo I4, all else being equal, I would not get the I4 even if it's a Honda I4.
Save the V6s! While an i4 turbo is nice in terms of power and MPGs, it doesn't beat the smoothness and feel of a V6.
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post #11 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 04:24 PM
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I didn't see in any magazine write up of the new Camry that there would not be car play or android auto. But then I didn't see anywhere where it said there would be. So we will have to see.
Yeah Toyota is on a war path with CarPlay and Android Auto for some reason (as if car manufacturer's have done better in the past):

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...y-android-auto

If I had to guess, it is because of increased WiFi hotspot use in cars and therefore they do not want Apple and Google to have all of the control but want a piece of the pie for advertising and other reasons.

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post #12 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 04:34 PM
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Yeah Toyota is on a war path with CarPlay and Android Auto for some reason (as if car manufacturer's have done better in the past):

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...y-android-auto

If I had to guess, it is because of increased WiFi hotspot use in cars and therefore they do not want Apple and Google to have all of the control but want a piece of the pie for advertising and other reasons.

Ah! Thanks for the info.

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Save the V6s! While an i4 turbo is nice in terms of power and MPGs, it doesn't beat the smoothness and feel of a V6.
The reason I bought V6 Accords is not because of the power (although the power is nice to have). It's because I didn't want vibrations at idle that come along with the Honda I4.

From what I've seen of other automakers who have ditched the V6 for a turbo I4 is that the turbo engines can be fuel efficient if babied. But drive them like you would normally drive a V6 in day-to-day driving and the V6 seems to use less fuel than the turbo I4. The turbo I4 looks good on paper only.
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post #13 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 04:45 PM
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IMO the Camry has been a nice looking automobile, but during the few times I had an opportunity to drive one (typically a rental) I didn't care much for the way it handled compared to an Accord. However, the next time I'm in the market for another car if Toyota still makes a Camry with a V6 and multi-speed AT I will definitely give it a look.

One thing I will never do is buy an Accord with a 4-cyl. turbo engine & CVT.
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post #14 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 04:45 PM
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Anyone remember the days of 4 spd autos...or even 3 spd autos?

10 speed automatics = unreal. Is that not trying to break into CVT territory without actually using a CVT?

Back to the point - I might shed a small tear if Honda dropped the V6 in the Accord. It's such an amazing engine. Aside from the choppy suspension, there is nothing I dislike about my Accord and the V6/6AT is the shining point of it.

Wonder if Honda might go the direction of say...Hyundai or Kia? Well I'm too lazy to look it up but I thought I remembered the Sonata or Optima having an I4 NA, V6 and then a I4 turbo option on one or the other.

IF Honda were going the route of dropping a turbo I4 into the Accord, do y'all think it would have enough to outrun the V6?

Are there Honda turbo I4 platforms already in production that might get transplanted into the Accord? I'm not super familiar with Honda's history...

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post #15 of 231 Old 01-09-2017, 04:53 PM
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Anyone remember the days of 4 spd autos...or even 3 spd autos?

10 speed automatics = unreal. Is that not trying to break into CVT territory without actually using a CVT?

Back to the point - I might shed a small tear if Honda dropped the V6 in the Accord. It's such an amazing engine. Aside from the choppy suspension, there is nothing I dislike about my Accord and the V6/6AT is the shining point of it.

Wonder if Honda might go the direction of say...Hyundai or Kia? Well I'm too lazy to look it up but I thought I remembered the Sonata or Optima having an I4 NA, V6 and then a I4 turbo option on one or the other.

IF Honda were going the route of dropping a turbo I4 into the Accord, do y'all think it would have enough to outrun the V6?

Are there Honda turbo I4 platforms already in production that might get transplanted into the Accord? I'm not super familiar with Honda's history...
I remember old GMs with a two speed auto transmission. I also recall the original 1970s Accord with a 2 speed Hondamatic. Times sure have changed.

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