Hey guys. So I have a 2016 Coupe Touring. About a month ago I noticed a really quiet noise, that sounds like a piece of trim rattling that was towards the front of the car. It started off super quiet and something that would just be overlooked but it has grown every so slightly louder and sometimes getting to the point of being annoying recently. It seems to do it mostly when the car is in VCM mode, and you increase the throttle very slightly so that it tries to hold in VCM mode but then jumps back to six 6 cyclinder mode. Well during that transition there will be a quiet rattle or tapping sound and then when all 6 cylinders engage it immediately goes away. So long as it stay on 6 cylinder its fine.
Anyway I took it to the dealer for service today and mentioned it to the service rep. The mechanic rode with me and we had to drive for a while before he could hear it, as its so quiet, but finally he heard it and we brought the car back to the shop. They took like and hour trying to reproduce it in the shop with their computers hooked up to it and finally it did it again. They said that the valves are sticking when in VCM mode and they have no clue why. First time they've ever seen it. So I called the largest Honda dealer and they said they have never heard of that problem either especially on the 2016 models.
I've looked around myself and I have never seen anyone report a problem similar to mine either and I was just wondering if anyone else has? Car only has 12K miles.
Nobody ever heard of this? I know Honda had VCM issues in the past. Is this something that is a known issue with this car?
Did you discuss what recourse you have with the dealership? Will they have a Honda engineer look into the matter? Maybe you have a lemon, whereas you can instigate a possible buyback?
Worse case scenario you can see if the VCM Muzzler or K-Tuner options help by disabling the VCM. If you cannot make any traction with Honda.
Well I'm the second owner so no buy back for me. I took it to two different dealers and neither had a clue. I think I figured out what it is though. This service news article describes the problem down to a "t" which means Honda is aware of the issue. https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2016/SB-10084330-2280.pdf
It's funny that you bring this up. My 2014 V6 would make a bit of a "sputtering" sound when VCM would disengage, but it was very brief and it didn't do it every time. I didn't think anything of it and nothing bad ever happened. It would also make a metallic rattling sound when slowing down towards a certain stop sign in my neighborhood. I never could tell if it was coming from the engine or transmission (happened when slowing from 25-30 mph to about 10-15 mph before coming to a stop) and it was extremely brief like a second long at most. Again, nothing bad ever came of it.
Fast forward to my 2017 V6 and it also makes the "sputtering" sound occasionally when VCM disengages under acceleration. I guess this is normal behavior, I'm not sure. What doesn't seem normal is that the metallic rattling sound when slowing down approaching that one stop sign in my neighborhood now lasts much longer. It went from a quick metallic 'clunk' to sounding like I'm dragging a heatshield and its skipping across the pavement. The car seems to run fine, but that sound can't be normal. I haven't taken it in yet because it's so hard to reproduce and I doubt a tech would be able to hear it because I can only hear it when the audio system is muted and the A/C fan is on low or off.
I wonder if we're having the same issue?
I have KTuner, and I'm tempted to try disabling VCM and see if the noise is still present. I honestly can't recall if the rattle went away when I turned VCM off in the 2014 because I was usually blasting music. I do know the sputtering sound went away once I turned it off. That noise was a lot more frequent than the metallic clunking sound approaching the stop sign.
It's funny that you bring this up. My 2014 V6 would make a bit of a "sputtering" sound when VCM would disengage, but it was very brief and it didn't do it every time. I didn't think anything of it and nothing bad ever happened. It would also make a metallic rattling sound when slowing down towards a certain stop sign in my neighborhood. I never could tell if it was coming from the engine or transmission (happened when slowing from 25-30 mph to about 10-15 mph before coming to a stop) and it was extremely brief like a second long at most. Again, nothing bad ever came of it.
Fast forward to my 2017 V6 and it also makes the "sputtering" sound occasionally when VCM disengages under acceleration. I guess this is normal behavior, I'm not sure. What doesn't seem normal is that the metallic rattling sound when slowing down approaching that one stop sign in my neighborhood now lasts much longer. It went from a quick metallic 'clunk' to sounding like I'm dragging a heatshield and its skipping across the pavement. The car seems to run fine, but that sound can't be normal. I haven't taken it in yet because it's so hard to reproduce and I doubt a tech would be able to hear it because I can only hear it when the audio system is muted and the A/C fan is on low or off.
I wonder if we're having the same issue?
I have KTuner, and I'm tempted to try disabling VCM and see if the noise is still present. I honestly can't recall if the rattle went away when I turned VCM off in the 2014 because I was usually blasting music. I do know the sputtering sound went away once I turned it off. That noise was a lot more frequent than the metallic clunking sound approaching the stop sign.
If you have K-Tuner turn the VCM off and never look back....... If not I bought the VCM Muzzler until I got my K-Tuner and it worked perfect as well. I had the thing on my car before I had 500 miles on my car.
I just turned off VCM using KTuner yesterday. This car seems smoother than my 2014, so the lack of the rumble strip effect isn't as noticeable. However, the lack of lag when trying to accelerate gently or when approaching an incline is wonderful. I can't stand how VCM pretty much requires you to stab the throttle fairly hard just to avoid losing too much speed on a hill. I'm more of a finesse kind of guy, who likes to feather the throttle rather than utilize a more ham-fisted approach. Unfortunately, many people tend to be ham-fisted which is why ECON mode seems to work so much better for them than it does for me. My Mother is one of them. Her right foot is either burying the accelerator in the carpet or it's on the brake, nothing in between. Because of that, she'd never even notice the VCM lag that drives me insane. But I digress...
The sputtering/rattle upon VCM disengagement is gone, of course. That strange "dragging a heatshield" sound when approaching that uphill stop sign is pretty much gone, as well. I can hear a quick, soft metallic clunk while slowing down that I believe is just the transmission grabbing a lower gear. My old car made the exact same sound in the exact same places. I'm assuming that extra rattling I was hearing on top of the gear change was indeed VCM and possibly the valves sticking. I'm gonna drive it around without VCM at least until the break-in period is over at 600+ miles. Then, I'll turn VCM back on for a bit to see if the noise comes back. If it does, time to visit the dealer.
Yea my transmission makes that noise as well. Glad turning VCM off helped..... I drive just like you and feathering the gas up hill I noticed the VCM in the first day or 2 I got the car off the lot. I dont think I will ever turn it back on..
Yeah I figured the transmission noise was normal since my 14 had it, but my 14 never made that horrible rattling sound on top of it. That bugs me, and makes me feel that disabling VCM is just putting a band-aid on the problem. I think I'll be able to rest easy and leave VCM disabled once I figure out what's going on.
The car really is so much nicer to drive without VCM. It feels and sounds like a car with a smooth V6 should. VCM is great and all for steady cruising on a completely flat highway, but if that constitutes the majority of your driving routine then why even bother getting the V6? Running on 3 cylinders makes the car no smoother and no more refined than the 4-cylinder while still not quite matching its efficiency. It's always seemed pointless to me, as I bought the V6 for the smooth, effortless power it delivers around town and in the suburbs. VCM not only ruins the refinement advantage of the V6, but it makes it feel sluggish and unresponsive in the 25-55 mph suburban driving that I do 95% of the time. Just to give you an idea of how unhelpful VCM is in my driving routine, I saw less than a 1 MPG decrease in my per tank average with it disabled on my old car. With it off, I was averaging 29 MPG (calculated at the pump, not going by the computer) in my city/suburban driving routine and would still see low to mid 30's the few times I took it on the highway. 1 MPG is not worth the downsides of VCM.
I had 14 EXL V6 that never made this noise, but I’ve been driving myself crazy trying to figure out why my 17 EXL V6 (with only 400 miles) is making these noises until I found this post and read the service bulletin, now I think I’m on the right track.
I had them look at it when I brought it back for an inspection sticker last week. They drove it around the lot and claimed they couldn’t hear anything. I’m waiting for it to be “broken in” before I take it back again.
I took the video when pulling into my driveway which has a stone wall on one side so the sound was bouncing off the wall making it louder. With the a/c on or the radio playing the sound is less noticeable. Now that I have narrowed the noise down to possibly a VCM issue I took it for a ride and the noise isn’t there until the engine warms up, and after that it’s only under light and steady acceleration. When I’m coasting, the noise stops.
How many times would you put up with “we can’t duplicate the issue” before investing in a K tuner to disable the VCM?
Yeah, that doesn't sound right at all. Mine makes an interesting sound when accelerating gently from a stop with the revs below 2000, almost like an exhaust "burble". My 2014 made the same sound under the same conditions (with or without VCM), so I've dismissed it as normal. Your noise sounds more like a metallic clunking sound than an exhaust noise.
VCM only engages when cruising steadily above about 20 mph in my experience, so I don't think VCM would be causing that noise if you're accelerating at very low speeds like in the video.
Mine also randomly makes a strange noise when accelerating in a high gear at low engine speeds, especially uphill. The noise is similar to when you're trying to drink through a straw but there's nothing left in your cup. It's not very loud, but I can still hear it over the radio if I don't have it turned up much. My friend said it sounded like wind noise but it's definitely coming from the engine. I seriously doubt the engine is pinging as I'm running 89 octane on the stock tune minus VCM (thanks to ktuner). I guess it is possible that I got a bad tank of gas but I doubt that. Unfortunately, it's too random to even bother trying to get the dealer to diagnose it. It's definitely irritating.
So, here’s a little update. I dropped off the car on Wednesday and had a tech ride with me to hear the noise. For the first five minutes of the ride the tech couldn’t hear it. It wasn’t until the car hit a slight incline at low speed then he heard the noise. They have been working with Honda trying to figure it out and they have it narrowed down to something internal in the engine. The service advisor has told me that several techs have driven the car to experience the noise and they did some testing and made a few adjustments on the top end. Three out of four techs believe the noise is now gone. The fourth is unsure of whether the noise is gone or if he’s now numb to it so I must drive it with them next week to see if I can still hear anything. If the noise is still there they will have to replace parts on the bottom end. I’m hoping it’s fixed because I feel a bit uneasy having a brand-new engine with 500 miles taken apart this early in the car’s life.
I'm the OP. I took my car to the shop a while a back for the clattering noise mine was making. The tech rode with me and heard the noise and said it most definitely was the valves sticking. Left it with them for 3 days and they replaced all the valves and a solenoid. After I got the car back the noise was louder than it was before and sometimes the throttle wouldn't respond. So I took it and traded it for a brand new 17 Touring Coupe which is not covered in that TSB linked earlier.
Needless to say the 17 makes the same noise. Except it will do it whether its in VCM or not, unlike the 16. It will also do it in different gears unlike my 16 that only did it in 6th gear. I have not seen any other thread here on DA about anyone else having a similar issue with their V6 accords, but there are several threads on the Odyseey and Ridgeline forums about this very same issue. So far I have not seen anyone who has successfully had it fixed or found the root cause of the noise and I have searched the internet. I'm not even gonna bother taking my 17 to the shop until it either gets much worse, as the back and forth at the dealer is just a huge waist of time. Other than this little nagging noise I love the car. Wouldn't buy anything else. Not even a 6-6:0
Yeah my 17 makes the noise even with VCM disabled and I have no idea what could be causing it. My theory is the torque converter because I can hear a similar noise and feel some vibration when accelerating from a stop up even a slight incline. Man, I hope that isn't it. Sadly, the torque converter makes the most sense since the 6AT is shared among the Ridgeline, V6 Accord, and pre-2018 Odyssey and we're all having similar symptoms.
What the heck happened to Honda and their techno-advantage? It seems your engines have sticky rocker arms, not sticky valves. According to that TSB, the VCM-VTEC pin does two things. Either it does not lock fully into place and taps or it remains locked in place when it is not supposed to be locked which causes the engine to run like crap.
Has technology finally gotten the best of Honda? A Peter Principal effect so to speak? Over the last few decades Honda has produced millions of “dual-lobe performance” VTEC engines with absolutely amazing quality and reliability. Has anyone heard of even one VTEC issue on the “dual lobe” design? I’ve not.
But now they use VTEC for VCM and get it wrong? Wow! A botched execution on behalf of Honda? Who thought that day would come?
Keep in mind Drive Accord represents a tiny slice of the millions of Accord drivers all over the world. Most have absolutely zero issues with their car, I've never read a long term professional review that had issue with VCM, and I've personally never experienced a single issue with VCM in our Pilot or Accord. I drive 100-200 miles a day and have plenty of time to listen for oddities and my fiance drives the Pilot roughly the same amount. Both have been on significant road trips and I'll chalk our excellent fuel economy up to Honda's technology working well. Heck, most 9th gen V6 owners here don't even have issues.
I'd venture to guess most of the hesitation experienced upon acceleration is due to the transmission or driver error than the VCM, which engages and disengages in fractions of a second. However, uninformed drivers read forums and get worked up in a frenzy over non-existent issues which creates placebo effect.
The now distraught, and misinformed, driver logs on to the forum to add to the frenzy online and encourage other drivers to listen to every noise their car makes while traveling down public roads of questionable quality.
In short, take everything you read here with a grain of salt.
I stopped by the dealer this morning to take another listen to the car to see if what they had checked so far made any difference. Sadly, it did not. What they did notice is that they can replicate the noise by revving the engine in drive with the brakes applied. I guess that’s a step in the right direction.
So after months of trying to capture the sound on video, and the noise not happening when I was recording I finally manage to capture it on one of the loudest episodes I've had so far. You can hear it between 8 and 14 secs in the video. Maybe one of you guys can tell me what it sounds like to you. You can get a hint of how I was pressing the throttle by looking at the lighted gauge ring and the fuel economy meter.
Mine does the same thing. Here is the interesting part. It makes the same noise in 6th gear, low speed (best heard at 45-50 mph) when easily rolling on the throttle just up to the point where VCM will disengage. Noise goes away. However, if I keep rolling on the throttle the noise will return when it is just shy of the point of unlocking the torque converter or downshifting to 5th gear.
Now - all that being said, I have 97,000 flawless miles with perfect used oil analyses.
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