I have a 2003 honda accord i4 navigation with 90k on it. its eitherr i keep the accord or i get an 03 maxima black on black with 60 k. its gonna be hard letting go of the nav, but the power difference is immaculatee. anyy suggestionss?

Unless your Accord has problem or you can get a Maxima with factory extended warranty (certified vehicle), I would suggest you to stay with your Accord UNLESS you really feel like you need more speed and room...

I am not a big fan of build-in Navi (unless it's free :D ) since GPS is cheap nowadays and I can carry over when I travel too.

i would stay with the accord myself..... you'll have less problems in the long run.....

but, not saying that the nissan is a bad car either, JMHO.....

sorry but nissan quality is not up to the ranks of a honda...believe me, i have had both!!!

Is 03 Maxima the latest model or previous one?

Is 03 Maxima the latest model or previous one?
Last of the previous gen, when made in Japan. But it's still a miserable car. No comparison to Accord, except in power, and the Max isn't any big deal there unless it has the manual trans. (the Max automatic is a Fred-Flintstonian 4-speed).

Back in Sept 2006 I bought a 2003 Maxima SE 6-speed with leather HLSD and the Works to replace my mighty BMW 540 6-speed. There's LOTS of engine power, and the Xenons are awesome, but that's really about it.

The handling of the stock suspension stinks. It was improved with the addition of an aftermarket rear sway bar, but it still felt very non-linear. The leather is cheap, the (OEM) radio was constantly broken, the paint chipped easily, there's lots of wind noise and road noise, the steering is vague & the turning circle is like that of a Ford Country Squire, it had REAL BAD torque steer issues, the cable-operated shifter (no rod linkage after 2001) was rubbery and vague, there was a general cheap/plasticky feeling that pervaded the entire car.

Reliability-wise, it was no better than the 130K-mile BMW 540 I'd owned previously. After the first $550 occurrence, I lived in fear of the "Service Engine Soon" light coming on again, and the monetary and spousal friction that came with it.

I could go on, but you get the point. I only test drove it for 15 minutes before buying it because I was so intoxicated by the power and the 6-speed manual. And there was nothing "wrong" with my particular car; in fact, my car was in excellent condition! These are issues that are pretty much inherent in the basic design.

I now have a 2006 Accord EX-L V6 sedan and I LOVE that car! As an additional bonus, my car insurance went DOWN by $123/yr when I replaced the Maxima with the 3-year-newer Accord!

The Maxima is great if your main concern is straight-line speed, and/or you are single, and/or you don't mind putting time and expense into your car to keep it on top of its game, OR are a Nissan tech yourself. With a wife and three kids, I realized I didn't have the time or money to use this Maxima as my daily transportation.

I hope this diatribe was helpful to you. Please disregard if you've done all this research and have your mind made up or are a "Maxima person" or "Nissan person".

Nissans look good on paper and they have nice power, which helps winning people over with excitement when they are purchasing a car. However, lack of fit and finish, as well as reliability need to be considered. It seems more than half of the people I hear recalling their nissan experiences say the same thing, that being that they liked the power but reliability and quality left something to be desired. The VQ is a cool engine, and I like the looks of the new altimas, but I wouldn't want to shell out any serious cash for a nissan any more than I'd want to shell out for a GM. That being said, I love the 350Z and G35, though I don't think I'd ever be able to take the plunge unless they improve reliability. My 6mt coupe is more than enough excitement for me (I love my car).

maybe that was it haha, i was overwhelmed with the power of it when i test drove it and the xenon lights, it seems as if i should probably stick to my car thanks everyone

Forgot to mention that before I bought my '06 Accord, I drove the Maxima to go test drive a 2003 EX-L w/nav (but it was a V6). By the time I backed the '03 Accord out of the guys drive way, I could already tell it was superior to the Maxima. No kidding! It was probably a combination of the structural stiffness and steering precision, but whatever the reason, there was no doubt about the Accord's superiority.

If need more power, I suggest you try a '06+ Accord. My '06 V6 felt significantly more powerful than the '03 V6 I mentioned above. I coudn't have lived with the '03's acceleration, but am happy with my '06's (both are autos). I read that the 4-cyl models also upgraded power in '06, but I haven't driven it, so don't know how that translates to a butt-dyno reading.

For more insight, find my thread on this forum, "You might be a 7th gen owner if..." and compare it to Maxima.org's thread of a similar nature (I provided the link within the above 7-th gen thread). The vast majority of the 7th-gen Accord owner's responses are positive ones, whereas most Maxima owners used the exact same topic to post complaints. :yes:

My lession learned: My Maxima single-handedly taught me that straight-line acceleration isn't everything. Neither are Xenon headlamps, but they ARE cool.

All that said, you will run into people who vociferously defend their Nissans. I can't figure out why... :dunno:

Great info, Succinct, even if you don't exactly live up to your name.

Those older Maximas were much more fun to drive than the newer ones. The suspension was very flawed, as you say, with large geometry changes when getting on or off the throttle, but did make the car feel responsive.

What about the new Altima? Stunning.

Yep, I'm still in the hunt.. Haven't decided yet.. Still plugging along in the old 96 trooper.

I was considering the Altima.. Infact it was the first test drive a few weeks ago.. I was impressed. Thank God for the internet. Didn't take long to start reading about problems after problems.. Not easy problems either.. major engine problems. Recalls like crazy on the early 2000+ models and war stories about manifold screws or something in the precat getting into the engine and basically ruining the motor. Enough to shy me away.

Nissan Altima Reliability Rating on MSN (http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/reliability.aspx?year=2004&make=Nissan&model=Altima)

More Detail on the engine problems from MSN (http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/Reliability.aspx?year=2003&make=Nissan&model=Altima#Engi)

It's a shame.. A really fun fun car to drive in the 2.4 CVT I test drove. 1st automatic tranny I actually liked. Google after google, I can't find any supporting evidence they've got these issues resolved.. Just user reviews that support by the dealer or Nissan is lousy, so they got stuck with a newer car with a blown motor.. Wow.. Wasn't Nissan always one of the big top three Japanese makers. I hate to see it.. I really hope I'm just over-exhaggerating and it's really relatively isolated, but the data doesn't show it.

So now I'm back looking into Hondas.. Looked at and drove an outback subaru.. I like the practicality of the cargo space, so I thought, "ok, is there a comparable Honda product?" ... so now I'm researching CR-V's, if I can get over the "chick-car" stigma.

I might still have to say "screw an SUV" and just do the Accord. My possible choice would be an EX-L (leather) 2.4L Auto (the wife has to have an auto.. not my choice).

My brother in TX is a huge Nissan fan. But he can't really say why, other than he bought his first one, a '91 Stanza, and had great luck with it. So he's been buying them every since.

They've had since then an '00 or '01 Altima, an '03 Maxima, and an '05 Maxima. Also an '00 Frontier CC, an '04 Nissan Titan, and now an '06 Titan.

They haven't had any *major* problems with them, but they always seem to get called back in for little nagging TSB fixes and a few recalls. Doesn't seem to bother him...he still sings the Nissan song. Funny thing is, they don't drive, literally 5-6K per year, per vehicle. And then they trade them on something newer. They never get a real chance to stretch their legs and really push/test them.

I, on the other hand, already have 15,600 miles on mine, and it's only 5 months old. I'll definitely be getting MY money's worth of the Accord, baby! :yes:

I have a 2003 honda accord i4 navigation with 90k on it. its eitherr i keep the accord or i get an 03 maxima black on black with 60 k. its gonna be hard letting go of the nav, but the power difference is immaculatee. anyy suggestionss?

No biased opinions here.. I'm sure the nissan forums will be just as biased.. do some research and go from there.

so noone likes the new found power on the top of the line Altima not to mention all models and the tricked out Altezza style "MMC"-type rear lenses upgrade?? :wave:

Funny thing...I saw a whole row of the new ones at our local Nissan dealer. Other than the ones that were the "top of the line", with the 17-18" wheels, the rear deck spoiler, etc, the basic ones looked dumb. You know, the ones with 15" wheels with wheel-covers, basic paint, no pinstriping, etc. It's like they took a decent-looking, nicely-designed body and stuck it on the wheels and chassis of a manure spreader.

But maybe that's just me. :dunno:

See my treatise in Kabong's thread ("European luxury"). After my Maxima experience I'll never own another Nissan. The extra baubles all simply make it more like a "Ginger" car than a "Mary Anne" car anyway...

(Just my 2 cents)

Also - don't neglect to do some resale value research. Nissan consitently trails Honda in that category too. What happens is you'll pay as much or more when new for an equivalent Nissan, but then after 4 years the re-sale value of the Nissan is at least $1500 to $2000 under the Honda. I did this little study on my old 2003 Maxima (which I had to practically give away to get rid of) and a 2003 Accord EX-L at equal mileage, according to KBB and NADA.

The extra baubles all simply make it more like a "Ginger" car than a "Mary Anne" car anyway...

Hahaha...that's funny you used the term "baubles", because my wife when she sees a new Maxima, like my bro's, calls it a "bubble" car.

:lmao:

I went from an 02 Maxima (same as the 03) to an 07 AV6 EX-L and honestly speaking, I would rather have the 5.5G Maxima over a K24A 7G Accord (although the 06+ AV6 is a different story altogether).

Qualitywise, the only issue I had was a blown MAF sensor and I believe there is a recall on the CPS (Crank Position Sensor). Aside from that, my Maxima was rock solid and although interior "seems" cheap, it NEVER exhibited any interior rattles or deformities. (Unfortunately, Nissan went in a direction with the 6G Maxima that pushed a number of 4G (95-99) and 5G (00-03) Maxima fax to the Infiniti G35 or Acura TL (or in my case, the AV6). )

As I had owned my Maxima for 5 years, I can state that the power delivery is VERY addictive although the handling left a lot to be desired and has a much sharper appearance (IMHO) than the 7G Accord.

In discussing the Nissan bias, my prior three car purchases were Nissans. Each had their quirks and arguably may not have been as nice as the equivalent Honda but I DO NOT regret having owned each and the experience has been generally positive. The wife & I LOVE driving our Murano and still think it is one of the best looking cars on the street, despite being in its fifth model year. :thmsup:

The only Nissan products I would avoid are those manufactured at Nissan's Canton Mississippi assembly plant (http://www.plantautomation-technology.com/projects/nissan_canton/) (Armada, Titan, QX56, Quest and some Altimas.). It seems that products from that plant were/are plagues with quality problems.

I went from an 02 Maxima (same as the 03) to an 07 AV6 EX-L and honestly speaking, I would rather have the 5.5G Maxima over a K24A 7G Accord (although the 06+ AV6 is a different story altogether).

Qualitywise, the only issue I had was a blown MAF sensor and I believe there is a recall on the CPS (Crank Position Sensor). Aside from that, my Maxima was rock solid and although interior "seems" cheap, it NEVER exhibited any interior rattles or deformities. (Unfortunately, Nissan went in a direction with the 6G Maxima that pushed a number of 4G (95-99) and 5G (00-03) Maxima fax to the Infiniti G35 or Acura TL (or in my case, the AV6). )

As I had owned my Maxima for 5 years, I can state that the power delivery is VERY addictive although the handling left a lot to be desired and has a much sharper appearance (IMHO) than the 7G Accord.

In discussing the Nissan bias, my prior three car purchases were Nissans. Each had their quirks and arguably may not have been as nice as the equivalent Honda but I DO NOT regret having owned each and the experience has been generally positive. The wife & I LOVE driving our Murano and still think it is one of the best looking cars on the street, despite being in its fifth model year. :thmsup:

The only Nissan products I would avoid are those manufactured at Nissan's Canton Mississippi assembly plant (http://www.plantautomation-technology.com/projects/nissan_canton/) (Armada, Titan, QX56, Quest and some Altimas.). It seems that products from that plant were/are plagues with quality problems.
You can stick up for Nissan all you want on this Accord forum, but no one else is buying it here. As mentioned, when I “resigned” from Maxima.org when I sold my bone-stock ’03 Maxima, I briefly listed my issues and mentioned I was replacing my Maxima with an Accord and received almost 100% positive responses regarding my decision. And that was a Maxima forum!

And it isn’t just me – in fact I received this e-mail from a friend just this morning:
“A friend here at work is experiencing some very costly repairs with his 2000 Maxima. Unfortunately, he’s not an enthusiast and he doesn’t DIY, but I thought I might be able to help him keep a little more $$ in his wallet. Do you know if anyone makes a Peake type of code reader for the Max? He has a bunch of idiot lights on now and they haven’t gone out despite throwing $2K in parts at it. His indie is telling him that he probably needs to have the dealer reflash the ECU because it doesn’t recognize all of the “new parts”. Dealer wants $90 to reflash and I thought if he could buy a code reader for the same amount, he’d be ahead of the game.

He really trusts his indy, but I question what he’s recently done – curious what you think. His car has 147K miles on it and he does about 30K a year. It was running rough on him so he brought it in for a major tune up. His CE light was on, and 2 other lights. Indy did plugs, filters, oil, etc and said the car ran fine – charged him $800 for the tune up. When he picked up the car, it still ran rough and all of the lights were on! So he left it overnight. Next day, Indy tells him his coil packs are bad and that it would cost less to simply replace them all! $1200 later, he has 6 new coil packs – Indy told him he spent 8 hours on the car removing all of the stuff to get to the coil packs – is that possible??? Car runs much better, but the idiot lights are still on. In the last year, he’s put about $5K into the car (cats, O2 sensors, ABS sensors, etc.). Sounds familiar…He still has 2 years of car payments left so he is major upside down on the car. He’s praying that nothing else will go wrong and just keep driving it until its paid off. Any thoughts?”

Unfortunately, my response to this e-mail is that what this Maxima owner is experiencing is normal for this car: The dealer has to handle all ECM re-flashes (which are required after replacing a MAF and other components), the coil packs are notorious on those cars, and replacing plugs and coils requires removal of the entire intake manifold. And this poor chap hasn’t even mentioned some of the other problems to be expected of such a hi-mile maxima, such as strut and wheel bearing noises - which also cost hundreds of dollars to fix. Nor was there any mention of the ubiquitous excess oil consumption issue.

As mentioned in another thread, I did a quick study of resale value of an ’03 Maxima with 70k miles and an equally equipped ’03 Accord with the same mileage. While the Maxima actually cost the same or more than the Accord when new, today its resale value is $1500 to $2000 less than the Accord, which reflects the market’s recognition that the Maxima, well, sucks. :thumbsdow

When I was car shopping, I seem to recall that nissans were far more expensive to insure, and that the resale values were horrible.

I live in the bay area CA and Nissans seem to be very popular in the crime ridden areas, for what it's worth.

You can stick up for Nissan all you want on this Accord forum, but no one else is buying it here. As mentioned, when I “resigned” from Maxima.org when I sold my bone-stock ’03 Maxima, I briefly listed my issues and mentioned I was replacing my Maxima with an Accord and received almost 100% positive responses regarding my decision. And that was a Maxima forum!

And it isn’t just me – in fact I received this e-mail from a friend just this morning:
“A friend here at work is experiencing some very costly repairs with his 2000 Maxima. Unfortunately, he’s not an enthusiast and he doesn’t DIY, but I thought I might be able to help him keep a little more $$ in his wallet. Do you know if anyone makes a Peake type of code reader for the Max? He has a bunch of idiot lights on now and they haven’t gone out despite throwing $2K in parts at it. His indie is telling him that he probably needs to have the dealer reflash the ECU because it doesn’t recognize all of the “new parts”. Dealer wants $90 to reflash and I thought if he could buy a code reader for the same amount, he’d be ahead of the game.

He really trusts his indy, but I question what he’s recently done – curious what you think. His car has 147K miles on it and he does about 30K a year. It was running rough on him so he brought it in for a major tune up. His CE light was on, and 2 other lights. Indy did plugs, filters, oil, etc and said the car ran fine – charged him $800 for the tune up. When he picked up the car, it still ran rough and all of the lights were on! So he left it overnight. Next day, Indy tells him his coil packs are bad and that it would cost less to simply replace them all! $1200 later, he has 6 new coil packs – Indy told him he spent 8 hours on the car removing all of the stuff to get to the coil packs – is that possible??? Car runs much better, but the idiot lights are still on. In the last year, he’s put about $5K into the car (cats, O2 sensors, ABS sensors, etc.). Sounds familiar…He still has 2 years of car payments left so he is major upside down on the car. He’s praying that nothing else will go wrong and just keep driving it until its paid off. Any thoughts?”

Unfortunately, my response to this e-mail is that what this Maxima owner is experiencing is normal for this car: The dealer has to handle all ECM re-flashes (which are required after replacing a MAF and other components), the coil packs are notorious on those cars, and replacing plugs and coils requires removal of the entire intake manifold. And this poor chap hasn’t even mentioned some of the other problems to be expected of such a hi-mile maxima, such as strut and wheel bearing noises - which also cost hundreds of dollars to fix. Nor was there any mention of the ubiquitous excess oil consumption issue.

As mentioned in another thread, I did a quick study of resale value of an ’03 Maxima with 70k miles and an equally equipped ’03 Accord with the same mileage. While the Maxima actually cost the same or more than the Accord when new, today its resale value is $1500 to $2000 less than the Accord, which reflects the market’s recognition that the Maxima, well, sucks. :thumbsdow

We can mainly go by our experiences 'eh'? That said, I stand by the fact that my Maxima was at least as trouble free as the 99 Accord 4 cyl which preceded it in my garage.

As far as I am concerned, your 03 was a bad apple. As I tracked my modded 02 Maxima frequently with other other 5.5G Maxima owners @ Etown over the years, the only other owner with problems had some extensive mods and questionable tuning (IMHO).

As for resale value being a barometer of a vehicles quality appeal, BMW quality is measurably less than Mercury (LINK) (http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/news/releases/pressrelease.asp?ID=2006133) but yet has the highest resale in the biz (LINK) (http://autos.msn.com/advice/article.aspx?contentid=4022645) dwarfing that of Mercury. ...guess the market needs LASIK when it comes to giving Mercury some love. :dunno:

As far as I am concerned, my unmodified '03 Maxima's issues were typical of that gen of Maxima with 70k+ miles.

Admittedly, I only put about 9k per year on my Maxima. Coupled with my babying it (to death) could have contributed favorably to my positive ownership experience. I am sorry that your experience was not as positive as mine.

I have owned a 1990 Maxima as well as a 1990 Accord (among others) and I found that I concur with everyone's sentiments on here. The Max was a slick ride in the sense that it had nice "baubles" but was constantly in the shop for all sorts of issues. On the other hand, my beautiful "MaryAnne" '90 Accord never needed to go in the shop with the exception of regular oil changes and one clutch replacement after 170k.

Gotta say the ladies in college much preferred riding in my Max than in my Accord... that was about the only plus.

Obviously they aren't all bad, but there seem to be a lot more bad apple nissans than there are accords. At least half of the people I hear from who have owned nissans have primarily negative things to say about them.

Hello-

I owned a 1996 Maxima GXE 5-Speed and absolutly loved the power and MT. That car was perfectly reliable over its 100K miles, so I traded it in for a 2003 Maxima 6-speed. The power and HIDs were awesome on that car, but like everyone here mentioned, the interior, handling, wind noise, rattles, turning radius, less than great Nissan dealers, etc all took a toll on my ownership experience. The paint was terrible and looked like it was sandblasted down to metal in less than 30K miles. It rattled in the doors, dash, rear deck in less than 10,000 miles. The valve covers were plastic and started leaking. The headlights were a theft target. U-Turns were impossible with the turning radius... Cell phone conversations on the highway were impossible with the wind noise of the A-pillar and sunroof. Within a few months of ownership, I was not happy with the car and felt my 1996 was a far better car than my 2003 even though the 2003 had much more power :-)...

So when it came time to buy a new car for my wife, we bought a 7-gen Accord EX. Every time I drove her accord, I felt is was a far better car than may Maxima. The awesome power of the Maxima just did not matter to me anymore. Her Accord has been absolutly perfect for 3.5 years, so I just traded in my Maxima for a 2007 EX-L I4 AT. And I am absolutly thrilled by the purchase and feel it was a huge upgrade from the Maxima. I too was a huge Maxima fan for 10 years, part of Maxima.org, etc, but have never looked back after switching to the Accord.

Good luck!

Welcome 4H, glad to have you! :thmsup:

I could only stand my Maxima for 3 months before I decided to sell it. There are those who say Maxima.org was full of ricers, and there were a lot of such guys on there, but there were also "normal" people too. No one ever said "I've never experienced that" when I researched problems with my unmodified Max. Instead, the issues were usually covered in detail on the FAQ's.

As a former Gen 5.5 Max owner, I recomend you check out the thread on this forum that I started, "You might be a 7th-gen owner if..." and compare it to the similarly-themed thread at Maxima-org for the 5th-gen guys there (I included a link in one of my posts here in the 7th-gen Accord thread). very eye-opening indeed.

fourhondas,

That's exactly the car I'd be considering, though I will try hard to have the wife drive a manual just once to see it's not like the last manual she drove (1974 VW Kubel Treffen) hehe.. But I love the honda 4, though I'd also love to fit a 6 in the budget, have to have leather period (two little kids) so I guess that's an EX-L of some kind.. maybe an I4 manual, I4 auto or V6 auto.. One of those I guess. If I put money on it, I4 auto. I drove one and it felt quite adequate for typical everyday driving, if I can get over that auto-tranny gear hunt when you're on the highway and you have to punch it. 20 bucks says the next gen will have a sequential shift?

fourhondas,

That's exactly the car I'd be considering, though I will try hard to have the wife drive a manual just once to see it's not like the last manual she drove (1974 VW Kubel Treffen) hehe.. But I love the honda 4, though I'd also love to fit a 6 in the budget, have to have leather period (two little kids) so I guess that's an EX-L of some kind.. maybe an I4 manual, I4 auto or V6 auto.. One of those I guess. If I put money on it, I4 auto. I drove one and it felt quite adequate for typical everyday driving, if I can get over that auto-tranny gear hunt when you're on the highway and you have to punch it. 20 bucks says the next gen will have a sequential shift?
Babs - to save a few bucks, you might want to try to go the route I did - certified pre-owned in lieu of brand new. The warranty is better-than-new at 7 yr/100k miles and an extra 12 mo/12k miles added onto the bumper-to-bumper. If you find just the "right" '06 or '07 on a Honda dealer's lot (as I did) it may allow you to afford that V6 in lieu of the I-4. It worked for me, but with the aggressive discounts now being offered on the new '07's, you'll need to work on your deal pretty hard...

Babs - to save a few bucks, you might want to try to go the route I did - certified pre-owned in lieu of brand new. The warranty is better-than-new at 7 yr/100k miles and an extra 12 mo/12k miles added onto the bumper-to-bumper. If you find just the "right" '06 or '07 on a Honda dealer's lot (as I did) it may allow you to afford that V6 in lieu of the I-4. It worked for me, but with the aggressive discounts now being offered on the new '07's, you'll need to work on your deal pretty hard...

:stupid: I don't think I will ever buy a brand new car again unless I really want that car. Certified pre-owned is a way better idea! :thmsup: :thmsup:

I'll take you on that 20 bet. Sequential shift will be in next-gen but only for Acura and will debut probably for the entire-line in 08-9 for the re-designed TSX. Yur only hope would be maybe..maybe the S2000 as it is in need of a massive MMC overhaul. I, personally think it's time to give the TSX something comparable to the S2000 and for heavens sake, give the S2000 a proper V6 without stepping on the TLs toes! This is how Honda and Acura will futher differentiate themselves to each other and their competitors and create a stronger brand awareness for themselves.

I just read another thread of yours in other section :wave:

Anyway, S2000 is a sports car, while TL/TSX/Accord are family sedan/coupes. It's hard to step on each other toes I guess. And I don't think Honda will roll out the new S2000 (or replacement) for another few yrs.

:stupid: I don't think I will ever buy a brand new car again unless I really want that car. Certified pre-owned is a way better idea! :thmsup: :thmsup:

Having been in the biz.. I can't agree more.. A clean low-miles used ride is THE way to go if you want to let the other sucker pay that 1st year depreciation. Look at the depreciation charts on any car model to see just how smart it is.. yeah so what if some other butt was in the driver seat breaking it in. That's what lysol is for. :banana: Just check your carfax report.. it's worth it.

Since I sold them, this whole "certified pre-owned" thing has come out.. I guess it means "clean title, our tech checked it out and changed the oil, no wrecks"?

I'd be ALL over a nice used one except I can't get the concept across to my wife and the inlaws... They don't understand 6 months to 1 year used = 2/3 to 4/5 saved off the price of a new one.

They don't understand 6 months to 1 year used = 2/3 to 4/5 saved off the price of a new one.

Perhaps your method of negotiating is superior to mine, but I've never heard of anyone getting a 1/2- to 1-year old car for 66% to 80% off the price of a new one...unless it had been totaled.

Do you mean you only pay 66% to 80% of the new car price? That seems more reasonable.

Otherwise, I used to feel the same way as you. But unless I personally knew the owner or had concrete proof that it was WELL-maintained, I'd now be leery of buying a used car. I say that even though I've had good luck with them up to now.

don't be so sure that carfax is accurate.....

my car has been in 3 different accidents..... only one of them shows up.....

granted tho, the insurance company never found out about the last one in 2005.... :paranoid: :deal:

babs,

just playing devil's advocate here......

who's to say that the car was borken in properly broken in and maintained (if at all)???? you know the dealer would never tell you its real history if the car has something to hide...... :thumbsdow

Welcome 4H, glad to have you! :thmsup:

** Thanks, this has been an educational forum with some great folks...

I could only stand my Maxima for 3 months before I decided to sell it. There are those who say Maxima.org was full of ricers, and there were a lot of such guys on there, but there were also "normal" people too. No one ever said "I've never experienced that" when I researched problems with my unmodified Max. Instead, the issues were usually covered in detail on the FAQ's.

** I agree. I found Maxima.org to be a great forum, very helpful with my issues like the famous 6-speed hesitation TSB (ECU update fixed it), HID headlight anti-theft kit (I live in the Northeast, with rampant thefts), 3rd gear grind (MT Transmission oil TSB), etc. There were some ricers there, but many people there were VERY helpful. Mine was unmodified, only the
clear markers & 6-disk changer in the trunk... Actually around month 3 was when I really regretted buying the MAxima and it was around that time we looked at the Accord 7-gen.. I kept it for 4 years and felt is was time to move on. Again, that car was an absolute rocket in straightline accelleration, but when locked in typical bumper to bumper traffic that was of little value.

As a former Gen 5.5 Max owner, I recomend you check out the thread on this forum that I started, "You might be a 7th-gen owner if..." and compare it to the similarly-themed thread at Maxima-org for the 5th-gen guys there (I included a link in one of my posts here in the 7th-gen Accord thread). very eye-opening indeed.

*** I saw that!!! And could not have agreed more... Since we now own (2) 7-gens -> one built in Japan and the other in Ohio, I can say they both appear to be of equal quality.....

The new annual Consumer Reports reliability ratings were published on-line today (will be out in print in the upcoming issue). Of the 36 marques rated, Toyota was #1 and Honda was #2, while Land Rover and Mercedes bring up the rear at #35 and #36, respectively.

Nissan, meanwhile, moved UP 2 spots to #24, yet is STILL the lowest-ranked Japanese brand other than Suzuki (which dropped 16 spots since last year). Nuff said... :thumbsdow

Speaks volumes.. It's a shame.. I probably saw 5 new altimas and two newer max's this morning.. to me - gorgeous cars.

I emailed the SALES MANAGER at the local nissan dealer on Monday, pleading for some objective evidence they've fixed the bugs in the 2.5L motor.. It's now Thursday and no reply.. That speaks bigger volumes because I actually know the guy. No more chances.

I'm sure when I ask my subie sales guy about the head gaskets, I'll probably get a plethora of information and probably get introduced to the service manager for discussion on it. That's the difference in sales people who do make a difference by at least trying. If that guy was selling hondas, I'd already have it in the garage, because he's busted his hump to know as much as humanly possible and worked to listen to me and inform me and sell me based on data and offer to swap out car seats and test it out WITH the kids and wife. If anything, he's the 1st I've seen that has "earned" it.

I think there's a code of silence at the nissan dealers about the engine trouble topic.. Pretty much if they know you know about their issues, they just rule you out as a buyer and go to the next sucker.... Ala chrysler/ford/gm style and now add VW, BMW and Rover.

I think the big H now has a golden opportunity I think here for absolute complete world domination. hehe.. just joshin', but they can definitely rule the market if they just keep on keepin on with top drivetrain quality and don't let design and finish quality slide for the sake of flash.

Speaks volumes.. It's a shame.. I probably saw 5 new altimas and two newer max's this morning.. to me - gorgeous cars.

I think there's a code of silence at the nissan dealers about the engine trouble topic.. Pretty much if they know you know about their issues, they just rule you out as a buyer and go to the next sucker.... Ala chrysler/ford/gm style and now add VW, BMW and Rover.

I think the big H now has a golden opportunity I think here for absolute complete world domination. hehe.. just joshin', but they can definitely rule the market if they just keep on keepin on with top drivetrain quality and don't let design and finish quality slide for the sake of flash.
Agree about the shame. Saw a Maxima SE yesterday like my old ’03, and as I gazed wistfully at the nice Altezza-like taillights (I really like ‘em), I chuckled at how I can now see past such baubles, at least on anything with a Nissan “hamburger” (emblem) on it. My “new” baubles, on my Accord, include the LED tails…

Just to comment on BMW – their 3-series got props as BMW’s best models and have proven to be pretty solid cars over the years. Even though CU makes special mention of problems with the cooling systems of the ’99 5-series V8 models, I’d have held onto my 540 if I’d had just a bit more dough and if it wasn’t my daily transportation; there’s just no other sedan near the price that offers the combination of power, luxury and handling of the 540. Someday (when my Accord is passed on to my daughter in 9 years or so, and pending spousal concurrence), I’d like to get an E46 M3 or an E90 335, and I fully acknowledge there’ll be a trade-off on reliability and ownership economics compared to the Accord.

I’m not going to paint a blue/white BMW logo on my face or anything, but they are generally well-done cars, especially if reliability north of 70k miles isn’t a top priority for you. I wish Honda had copied their brakes as much as they tried to copy other BMW aspects…

Regarding domination, Honda & Toyota already completely dominate the entire top 5 of CR’s new rankings if you include their extension brands (Acura, Lexus, and Scion).

Since I sold them, this whole "certified pre-owned" thing has come out.. I guess it means "clean title, our tech checked it out and changed the oil, no wrecks"?

I'd be ALL over a nice used one except I can't get the concept across to my wife and the inlaws... They don't understand 6 months to 1 year used = 2/3 to 4/5 saved off the price of a new one.
There ARE times when buying new beats buying used, and that’s when new models are being steeply discounted while resale prices remain strong. Example: My wife & I wanted to buy a used new-gen Odyssey last year, but there were precious few 2005s available with the DVD system (which my wife HAD to have), and the few available were selling well into the upper $20’s. We were able to get a brand-new 2006 model for basically $2k more than the used ones because we negotiated a deal in the $29’s (MSRP was $32,945). I think buying new in that situation was appropriate. :thmsup:

Guess what? There’s a similar situation with Accords right now: new ‘07’s are being steeply discounted while resale value remains strong (AND you plan to keep the vehicle a LONG time). If I’d have more money AND if the ’07 V6 automatic was available in Sapphire Blue (like my ’06), I think I’d have bought a new 2007 EX-L V6 non-Nav for maybe $25k or even a little less, whereas I paid 22,600 for my 14k-mile like-new car (I could maybe have done a little better, but after 4 hours of negotiating over multiple trips to the dealer I felt it was a decent deal). So I saved maybe only $2500 off buying new, but I really didn’t have that additional dough.

Certified Pre-Owned (CPO) – The clincher (in addition to color) in my case was that my car was “Honda Certified”. CPO means different things for different manufacturers. For Honda, it means the car passed a 150-point inspection (the dealer certifies this to Honda corporate as well as you) and so Honda corporate extends the B2B warranty to 4 yr/48k and drive-train warranty is extended to 7 yr/100k. For Acura CPO, you get that PLUS a free roadside assistance and maybe even an Acura rental car for each service visit (not sure about that last part). Other manufacturers offer their own mix of CPO bennies, but I think the long and short of it is that being “Certified” adds maybe $1500 - $2000 or so the value of the car. Also, Honda certified used cars can only be purchased from Honda dealerships.

Sorry I wasn’t “Succinct” but I had a lot to say! :D

I remember a friend with an older 750IL once.. Now that was some fun.. Punch it from 75 to 115 in a heartbeat and hang on. In a full-size sedan.. V-12 music all the way. no replacement for displacement.

I may have to narrow down to a V6 accord I think.. maybe just put the foot down and do a 6MT and just ask forgiveness from my wife.

Hey! It still looks like a respectible family sedan, right?! :naughty: So what if it will run like a scalded dog.. noone needs to know 'cept Daddy. hehehehe

Over here, I've never found any newer "previously loved" cars to go for much lower than the price that you can get it for new. In fact, most times I see that they are priced HIGHER than a brand new car, even with 10K miles :dunno: IMO, from the prices I see in my area, I would rather have the opportunity to break it in myself.

don't be so sure that carfax is accurate.....

my car has been in 3 different accidents..... only one of them shows up.....

granted tho, the insurance company never found out about the last one in 2005.... :paranoid: :deal:

It happens on one of my previous car too. I got a major accident but came out with CLEAN carfax report :D

:stupid: I don't think I will ever buy a brand new car again unless I really want that car. Certified pre-owned is a way better idea! :thmsup: :thmsup:

Also one thing nice about certified pre owned vehicle is about the extended (100K) warranty!! :thmsup:

Over here, I've never found any newer "previously loved" cars to go for much lower than the price that you can get it for new. In fact, most times I see that they are priced HIGHER than a brand new car, even with 10K miles :dunno: IMO, from the prices I see in my area, I would rather have the opportunity to break it in myself.

Certified car marked higher price than a brand new??? I can't believe it.. unless it's a Prius (the long waiting line) Which dealer you goto? Maybe I should avoid it (I live in bay area too) :D

Almost all the dealers have this. We got a 06 Sienna new down to $21,500, all the ads for 05-06 Sienna are way above that. Even like a base model they are advertising $21,988 CPO

Almost all the dealers have this. We got a 06 Sienna new down to $21,500, all the ads for 05-06 Sienna are way above that. Even like a base model they are advertising $21,988 CPO

Really? Man... maybe usually I check those 2-3 years old cars. I agree with you, if the new car costs cheaper or even just few thousand higher than a certified used one, I will just get a brand new.

Having been in the biz.. I can't agree more.. A clean low-miles used ride is THE way to go if you want to let the other sucker pay that 1st year depreciation. Look at the depreciation charts on any car model to see just how smart it is.. yeah so what if some other butt was in the driver seat breaking it in. That's what lysol is for. :banana: Just check your carfax report.. it's worth it.

Since I sold them, this whole "certified pre-owned" thing has come out.. I guess it means "clean title, our tech checked it out and changed the oil, no wrecks"?

I'd be ALL over a nice used one except I can't get the concept across to my wife and the inlaws... They don't understand 6 months to 1 year used = 2/3 to 4/5 saved off the price of a new one.

Not sure I agree. Depends on the make. Its hard for a dealer to buy Honda's and other brands that hold their value well back of book. A Chevy Malibu, yeah that can be bought 5 grand back of book all day at an auction. Show me a 1/2 to 1 year old CPO Honda for 2/3 what a fair price on a new one (not msrp) and I'll be interested. At least in my town this is not the norm.

I think the "Certified" and clean carfax reports give buyers peace of mind on some cars that they should be more concerned over. Its not hard for a dealer to push a car through the CPO checklist in there service department. A lot of damage happens to cars that never gets reported to DMV, and carfax won't have any of that information. The labels may have changed but it still the same game. Buyer beware...

Don't get me wrong I'm not saying always buy new. I'm just not sold on the used cars being sold at dealers, even if there labeled CPO. Most 1-3 year old cars (the range you'd have certified cars in) being sold at dealers came from auctions from the manufacturer's finance companies lease returns, rental car companies, or from other dealers. Again, its hard for dealers to pick the makes that hold there value well back of book, so they are in the car surprisingly close to what there in the new ones for. Search around the threads here for what people buy brand new Honda's for, as well as the extended care Honda warranties for and you'll see most people aren't paying retail for these things. No wonder why they don't see much savings on 1-2 year old Honda's or Toyota's bought from dealers.

Again, not saying used is bad, but in general I've bought used from private parties after having the car checked out by my own mechanic. Even while I was working in the bushiness as well, I wasn't impressed with what the dealers were in the car for. After all, if I stole a trade I made sure the under allowance was profit in my deal as it should be, so I made sure they booked the car in right so it wouldn't end up in some other salespersons hands. I expected everyone else to do the same as I wouldn't expect anyone to work for free either. Didn't you?

Excellent points. No I was in it for the bucks.. whatever it took.. Even auction cars we did well on, the pricing was top dollar with plenty of wiggle room.. The customer felt they got a fair deal, and we made out ok on the deal.. It was a win win. Happy customer, happy me. I didn't stick around in the business though.. I was way too honest. hehehe :)

I think someone mentioned the depreciation not being so much.. Typically, on a fresh 1 year big three or four Japanese car, maybe not but there's an occasional diamond in the rough.. I got a call about my trooper when they bought into a bunch of Troopers and Rodeos from auction.. $17,900 with 10k miles, 1 yr old, right next to a new one same color and options for $31,500 without the ski rack. Excellent engine and a scratch here or there.. My own checks and driving it enough to know it was solid was satisfactory at that price.. I only recently found out it was a rental in NV.. Eh, that fact hasn't bothered me the last 140k miles so I guess I lucked out. Virtually worthless now to every dealer but me but I'm amazed a 140k car of any kind now will fetch anything.. but then again, I'm not the guy looking for a reliable beater that he can afford.. dings pre-installed.

But given that I've proven to myself that I'm such a tight-wod that I'll keep a car and drive the snot out of it for a decade, I can see just peace of mind in a new car with new warranty.. I'm impressed though with Honda's certified warranty though.. That's pretty strong. I'd certainly consider a year old car with low miles, good record and minimal cosmetic marks that ran like new just for that 100k drivetrain extension. I'd drive a brand new one then the used candidate extensively for comparisons. My wife on the other hand puts a lot more value in brand-spanking-new, so that's the route we're currently taking.

Yeah only so long I could stand it too after a couple years I got out. I found it was no problem to do it and be honest to customers, but it was harder to be honest with myself and do a good job. I had to trick myself to believe the hours weren't so bad and I liked the job to keep myself in the right frame of mind to keep my energy and enthusiasm up to do really well. It wore on me after a while. It was quite an experience but I'm glad to be out.

There may be some good used buys out there, but just don't assume you're getting a good deal because its used. Compare what you could really get a new one for along with the warranty. Check out http://www.hondawarrantyinfo.com/benefits.php for your long term warranty. You can get more comprehensive coverage than just the powertrain warranty CPO cars tend to have for not all that much. Also don't assume just because its CPO that the car's top notch. You still have to take a look at things carefully. Unless you're an expert I'd take any used car to a 3rd party mechanic to get a non biased opinion.

You can get more comprehensive coverage than just the powertrain warranty CPO cars tend to have for not all that much.
Reminder: Honda's CPO warranty includes an additional 12 mo/12,000 miles warranty bumper-to-bumper, for a total of 4 yr/48k miles, as well as the power-train warranty. Doesn't solve world hunger or anything, but it's a little sump'n-sump'n... :thmsup:

All i can say is I am Blown away with the accords refinment. I bought an 05 v6 navi to replace the maxima. I would suggest getting the v6 accord instead of going to the maxima. Nissan is not a bad car but the accords wow factor is much bigger. Hope I helped out.

All i can say is I am Blown away with the accords refinment. I bought an 05 v6 navi to replace the maxima. I would suggest getting the v6 accord instead of going to the maxima. Nissan is not a bad car but the accords wow factor is much bigger. Hope I helped out.
I too had an ’03 Maxima (the rare 6-speed with limited slip diff) prior to my Accord, and the Accord’s superiority becomes vividly apparent before you can even pull out of the driveway. All the Maxima has going for it is straight-line acceleration and Xenon headlamps. Unless those two things matter more to you than handling, noise/vibration/harshness, structural integrity, quality, and reliability, then the Maxima is not even close to the 7th-gen Accord.