question about cell batteries

[princess]

OK, now I've owned my RAZR for about 18 months, I think.... & the battery has pretty much gone kaput. It happens to EVERY cell phone I get! A new one is ordered, but what am I doing wrong?????????????????:dunno:

The pattern is when they are new & follow the instructions 7 charge for 12 hours or whatever it says. At first they hold a charge for 3 days & several conversations.

I put it on the charger nightly & have it off & with me all day.

After a year, it will go low battery on me using it for an hour's talk time.

I've taken it (the battery) out & cleaned it up a few times.

Now it will go low in about 30 minutes of talking or 8 hours of standby.....then beep beep beep.

I carry it in my back pocket most of the time... so it gets sat on by my no-butt. It's not otherwise abused. I don't drop it. I don't get it wet. It used to have a thick Tinkerbell hard shell snap-on case, but now it's only got a thin decal style.

ALL cell phones get hot when I use them. Do I have some sort of anti-cell-phone property??????:alien::alien::alien::alien::alien:: alien::alien:

My prince's (even when we've had identical ones) rarely have needed a new battery. His also don't get as hot as mine.:dunno: Currently we have different ones sine he went higher tech on me.....

Any ideas????????????

[stevencrosbie]

You have a better track reccord that I do Princess.

I have a Nokia and needed a new battery in less than a year as it wouldn't last one day with the bluetooth on and no calls.....

I think it has to do with the amount of cycles you have on the battery. I put mine on the charger every night...even if it doesn't need it.

I've come to accept that the battery will not last as long as the contract....

[princess]

I wonder why when we both have had the same phones & use them about the same amount mine dies early.......:dunno:

Our daughter's RAZR is older than mine. She hasn't needed to buy a battery & hers is used more & forgotten on & off the charger.... in general abused. Dropped hard enough to fall apart. It's been wet & in for repairs from it. Yet, it's fine. :paranoid:

[alaimar]

Finally I can put my 2c on something here. I used to work for a cellphone store so i know a little about this. The rule of charging it all the way when you first buy it is very important, also you have to let it empty all the way every now and then. Depending on your use I personally charge mine every other night. More you charge it quicker the baterry will go. I've had my nokia for about 2 years now and haven't replaced it yet and it's still kicking strong.
You might want to try that instead of charging it nightly it should help alot.

[princess]

The first month or two I'm better about allowing it to go dead or near dead before charging it. After that I just get into a routine of puttin' it on the charger every night.

So I'm cooking the battery by caring too much? They need a little more neglect?

Odd, that my prince can charge his nightly though.:dunno:

My daughter is one off those that will be having a conversation & have to run because of a battery going dead. We gave her a car charger just because of that!

How will I ever learn to just allow it to ask me for a charge?:dunno:

I'd kinda like the next one to last longer!

[Terps_Fan]

Finally I can put my 2c on something here. I used to work for a cellphone store so i know a little about this. The rule of charging it all the way when you first buy it is very important, also you have to let it empty all the way every now and then. Depending on your use I personally charge mine every other night. More you charge it quicker the baterry will go. I've had my nokia for about 2 years now and haven't replaced it yet and it's still kicking strong.
You might want to try that instead of charging it nightly it should help alot.

I'm not sure I completely agree with that, as I have always made sure to charge my phone every night. In fact my phone is usually plugged in any time that I'm home and not using my phone, so the battery hardly ever runs down, and I've never had any problems with battery life in any of the phones that I've owned. In general I keep my phones between 2-3 years and I've never had to replace a battery in any of the last 5 or so phones that I've owned. My previous phones have been a variety of different brands (moto, LG, etc.) and I do try to take good care of the phone, but I don't do anything special with them. I just charge my phone every night and I've never had a problem. Maybe I've just been lucky...:thmsup:

[stevencrosbie]

I'd kinda like the next one to last longer!

:yes::yes:

Princess...what's up with your sig and no longer having the color for he Ridgeline?

[Peniole]

I think the nightly charges is what's killing your phones. I've never had a battery get so bad except on my land line panasonic (but that was after 4 years of use, and it was an NiMh not a lithium).

I always use nokia, been happy with them, and one thing they stipulate in their battery care section (for the phones I've used anyway) is to not overnight charge the battery.

I only charge mine when it beeps, or is down to one bar. The nokia I use for texting lasted 5 years without a battery change, and I was given a new one just last year. The other nokia I use for talking (and a lot of it, long distance relationship - av. 5000min/month - thank God for free mobile to mobile minutes) is 2 years old now and can still hold a charge for at least a 4 hour call, it needs charging once a day (used to be once every two days new) under heavy use, and can still hold a standby charge for 4 days (when we're not long distance ;))

[princess]

Like terps, my prince's is on the charger whenever he's home.:dunno:

My family blames my no-butt.:paranoid:

[Bill]

The key is the type of battery. Nickel Cadmium (NiCd) batteries fare better if they are allowed to discharge considerably before being charged, and should not be left on a charger for excessive periods of time. This is related to the "memory effect" experienced by NiCd batteries.

Nickel-Metal-Hydride (NiMH) and Lithium Ion (Li Ion) batteries do not experience these issues.

[Peniole]

Maybe it's not the fact that it's on the charger but that you need to take it off the charger once it's done charging so you don't overcook the battery. Yes it's true this is less of a problem in Li-ion batteries but some memory effect still lingers. Only the top end expensive Li-ion battries have almost completely gotten rid of the memory effect (see Citizen Eco-drive watches), I doubt they use those grade battries in cell phones.

[princess]

The one in it now that's about dead is a 780 3.7 lithium ion by motorola.

Funny, it was supposed to be a weak PHONE!!:lmao: (I'd heard bad things about the hinges)

Mine did lose a dot yesterday. I was texting & the main button's dot is gone now! It was just a stuck on one. It's been loose forever, but had managed to stay for all this time.:)


Too bad I can't steal the battery from my prince's watch!! He's got a citizen Eco-drive!!

[benjamming]

Which RAZR phone model?

[princess]

V3M, I think they call it.....:dunno:

[Bill]

[QUOTE=princess;177073]The one in it now that's about dead is a 780 3.7 lithium ion by motorola.QUOTE]

From your description of the issues, I thought it was a NiCd. I'm very surprised you're having these problems with a Li Ion battery.

[stevencrosbie]

My Nokia is an Li Ion as well...

[slab42]

2 major things that will kill your cell phone battery:

1. Leaving it on a CAR charger longer than needed. Your home charger has a regulator in it, and will not kill your battery, however your car charger should only be used long enough to charge your phone. If you leave it on the car charger all day, you battery's life will go down.

2. Charging your battery when it is not needed. Don't put your phone on your charger every night. New Lithium batteries don't have as bad of a memory like the older NiCd ones, but they still do. If you charge your battery every night, you are 'training' the battery to stay charged for one day, and that's it. Eventually it will kill the life of the battery.

I keep my phone off the charger until it NEEDS charging. I can leave my phone on for 2-3 days depending on use. On average, I connect my phone to the home charger every other night, sometimes stretching it to the 3rd night. I rarely ever use a car charger, unless my phone is dead and I need a charge. Even so, I never leave it on past full charge.

HTH

[princess]

My car charger has rarely been used. Just on trips, on the way home, 'cuz the phone's dead or near dead by then.

So it sounds like I need to put the new one on the charger as needed, not from habit. Problem is that before when I did that it would go dead when I was on foot & needed it. (would be no big deal in the car).

My prince's newest phone actually tells you to have it on the charger when not in use... so either it has some sort of auto shut off or isn't worried about the time on the charger.

My charger came with the phone, it's not the cradle kind...just the cord kind.

I may just be resigned to the fact buying a new battery or phone is going to be an anual thing. At least they aren't 80 bucks anymore!!:thmsup: They've gone down to about half.

Things that don't come with the Lith. batteries get replaced as soon as they are purchased. We don't like the NiCd. ones. I guess that's a good thing, huh?

I wanted to go to the 900 battery, but it's too bulky. I want to keep the slim lines of the RAZR since that why I got it. I don't know what he ordered... I'll look it up.

Well, I looked & it's an off brand with bad reviews. So I won't throw away the old one! I'll return it if need be. It says "lifetime warranty". Yeah, right. He also ordered another car charger. We didn't have one for my phone in the Ridgeline. I could've put mine in, but I never remember.:dunno: I was whining on our Fort Bragg trip about it.

[andysinnh]

So for the longest time I've been trying to figure out why I always kill the battery in my phone before my wife does - we both get the same phone on the same day, charge the same overnight, and use it about the same number of minutes.

I figured it out after lots of trial and error, at least in my case. Where she works, she gets a decent signal that's consistent during the day - so her battery drains pretty constant during a day, and then charges in a similar fashion.

In my case, I work right on the border of MA and NH - and in a building that's full of metal poles, computer labs, A/C ductwork, etc. I sat one day with my phone on my desk, and watched it constantly switch between towers in both states - one after the other - I think there were 3 that it was trying to triangulate with. And then if I walked to the lab or a stairwell, it would do the same thing. In my case, I found that the battery was lasting much less during a day even if I never used it, and the lifetime was drastically cut. On the weekends, the battery would drain the same as my wifes. So, my experience anyway, is that constant cell tower conflicts cause big power drains on a phone which lessen its life.

We both have Razr V3c's from Verizon - had them about 1.5 years. My battery died after a year, hers didn't die, but I replaced it when I did mine just as a matter of course. After I figured out this little tower issue, I upgraded to the larger battery for the Razr and the humpback cover - and now the battery holds the charge much better and I'm betting it'll last longer.

Anyway, how the phone sees towers during a typical day may have a bunch to do with battery life....

andy

[princess]

You know, that makes sense!!! Our house zaps things digital!! Where he works is closer to civilization.

So although I may not notice or see my phone popping into analog (he made me turn off the warning signal on a trip, I never turned it back on) it could be happening!

I have the same phone as you with the same service.....

I'm not moving, so I'll resign myself to annual batteries. It's much easier if it's planned! I still don't want the "humpback" one though.:D

Andy, your explanation makes the most sense to me.:thmsup:

The mystery just may be solved!!:banana:

I'm not the battery zapper, it's my house!!!

[jubatis]

...Where she works, she gets a decent signal that's consistent during the day - so her battery drains pretty constant during a day, and then charges in a similar fashion.... andy

This is a big factor in battery drain. All modern cell phones (especially ones using LiIon/LiPoly batteries) have built-in regulators to monitor the battery while charging. (The "charger" is just a source, that's all. All of the charging and monitoring circuitry is actually on-board the phone.) Unfortunately, the Razor's battery monitoring circuitry leaves a lot to be desired. It often incorrectly calculates the battery's capacity and at times under- or over- charges the battery, which leads to reduced battery life. It also many times causes the phone to shut down prematurely thinking the battery is low.

With CDMA phone service (Sprint, Verizon), the output of the transmitter on the phone actually adjusts to the background "noise" and to the output level of the tower. The tower controls this loop, not the phone. So even if you have a good signal, you can still be burning through batteries if the "noise" level in your area is high. I believe something similar exists for GSM, but I'm not sure how it works.

One other small point: li-ion and li-poly batteries actually do have a memory-effect, though it is much less noticeable than on NiCad batteries. Also, the chargers that are built into the phone handle balancing the individual cells (mostly to prevent the pack from catching on fire) which reduces this effect even more.

[princess]

Think weak signal here & strong one where my prince works makes sense to me. Many guests complain that their phones don't work well in my house. Some work in one room & not the next.

This house is weird. It's been like this since we moved in 18 years ago. We say we have ghosts & gremlins:lmao:.... radio control stuff will come on by themselves, lights will suddenly come on, TVs will change channels..... it's been fun. Wireless stuff all all sorts is the most effected. I claim all things digital since it has also effected the cable too.

Some have said they've seen a little boy. I'm not so sure. I think the old wiring causes conflict with higher tech stuff.:dunno:

I don't get paranoid about such things. I usually just laugh it off.:yes:

But messing with my charge on my cell phone is playing dirty!!!:)

[RTexasF]

Something else enters into the equation too...........the physical size of the current day batteries. They have gotten so tiny and thin compared to just a few years ago. The capacity has to have diminshed.

The LG phone I had previously was a bit bulky but the battery would last 10 days+. The current Motorola is small in comparison (wafer thin battery) and I'm lucky to get 4 days out of it and that's with no calls!! Size does matter.

[princess]

Possible, but when we've had the SAME phone & SAME battery & used them for the SAME minutes & charged for the SAME time....mine dies first everytime!!

This phone used to go 3 days with use. I could go to Disneyland for the weekend, text & take pictures in lines, & have a conversation 400 miles from home. Crystle has a knack of calling us when we're on the "grapevine".:D Now ny phone needs a charge when I get there..... & at the end of each day. If I use it too much, it's beeping at me by dinner!

I hope the new battery comes in before Friday....we're leaving sometime in the wee hours.

[princess]

Well, the new off-brand battery came yesterday & I charged it up. Today I had 2 lengthy conversations totaling about 2 hours. It's down to 1 bar, same as the worn out one. :dunno: So I think I'll also take my old battery on our roadtrip, just in case. I may return this one next week.

Is there a notch above lithium ion?


Is it possible that the old one being a 3.7v & the new one a 3.6v is also not helping????:dunno:

I'm getting frustrated!!!:bawl:

[Anzial]

I used to have a GSM Razr and the battery discharging very quickly in an area with poor to no reception. Motorolla covers the battery, not sure for how long, I was able to replace mine with ease, they even shipped it to me before I shipped back the old one IIRC.

[flippco]

If I use it too much, it's beeping at me by dinner

There is nothing like seeing 2 bars before you go to bed, only to have it start beeping at 4 in the morning. :thumbsdow

[messfeeder]

Maybe it's not the fact that it's on the charger but that you need to take it off the charger once it's done charging so you don't overcook the battery. Yes it's true this is less of a problem in Li-ion batteries but some memory effect still lingers. Only the top end expensive Li-ion battries have almost completely gotten rid of the memory effect (see Citizen Eco-drive watches), I doubt they use those grade battries in cell phones.

I think you hit it spot on. Most people leave their battery on the charger all night. You really shouldn't leave it on any longer once it is fully charged. Think about it; all that energy and nowhere to go. What is it doing to the battery?

I made the mistake with my last phone of leaving it on the charger overnight. After about 18 months it would barely hold a charge. Now I try to charge it in the morning when I get up so that I can grab it off the charger when I leave for work/school. So far, so good. We'll see how it fares in about a year! <crosses fingers>

[flippco]

I had a Nokia once and went with a third party battery and the thing was fried in a few months, so I just got a new phone.

[Anzial]

I think you hit it spot on. Most people leave their battery on the charger all night. You really shouldn't leave it on any longer once it is fully charged. Think about it; all that energy and nowhere to go. What is it doing to the battery?


If the phone is smart enough, it'll cut off the charging once the battery is full...

[messfeeder]

If the phone is smart enough, it'll cut off the charging once the battery is full...

Maybe it's the older one's that don't shut off automatically.:dunno: I was inside a Verizon store one day and every person who came in with a dead phone, they asked them if they left their phones on their chargers overnight. They told them not to do it because the phones don't shut off automatically.

[GlennD]

All rechargable batteries have a max number of charge cycles. In the Public Safety Motorola radios I work on They recommend only charging when needed.

For emergency service this does not work. Most officers charge the battery every night. We go through a lot of batteries!

Motorola lists ni-cad batteries to have at least 600 charge discharge cycles. Ni-mh for at least 350 cycles. I have not yet found the ratings for lithium batteries. By the way, a good battery is one that has at least 80% of its original rated capicaty.

[SEastHonda]

The age of a battery (including NiMH) is supposedly also related to its performance regardless of how it's used. This is something to be aware of when purchasing replacement batteries. Some low cost replacements may already be a few years old.

That said, I purchased the cheapest generic replacement battery I could find for my Razr and it has lasted over a year without any noticable performance degradation. I think it was around $4 from some site I found off Froogle.

[psyshack]

Im not a big cell phone user like the trend now days. With that said my last few moto's, samsung's and nokia's batterys have been great. Battery can last sometimes 2 weeks. I just got a new Nokia 6126 this week. 4 days on the battery so far and it hasn't dropped the level a bit according to the indicator. The 6126 is suppose to be a battery hog. So time will tell.