MT comparo: 7th & 8th gen Accord 6MT

[Fireball]

Here's Motor Trend data for 7th (http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0212_sport_coupe_comparison/specs_price.html) and 8th (http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/112_0804_fwd_coupe_comparison/specifications.html) generation Accord 6-MT coupe:

7th generation ... 8th generation

Weight: 3265 ... 3398 pounds
0-60: 6.2 ... 5.7 seconds
0-100: 16.4 ... 13.4 seconds
1/4 mile: 14.5 @ 98 ... 14.0 @ 102.5 mph

For people who think the 8th generation Accord 6MT is an underperformer, here's Motor Trend's test results for the Evo X (http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0803_subaru_wrx_sti_vs_mitsubishi_evolution_x/specs_and_test_data.html) compared with the Accord 6MT:

Evo X ... Accord 6MT

Weight: 3585 ... 3398 pounds
0-60: 5.2 ... 5.7 seconds
0-100: 13.9 ... 13.4 seconds
1/4 mile: 13.8 @ 99.3 mph ... 14.0 @ 102.5 mph

[chanke4252]

I feel like I've read this post about ten times over by now through the various threads that you have posted. first, we all know you are a fan of motor trend (rag). secondly, your car is not an evo nor will it ever perform as such. sure the 8th gen gets respectable #'s for what it is, but that's about all you can really say about it. way to use some of the the slowest reported #'s from the 7th gen and the fastest from the 8th gen. that's always a really unbiased way of comparing things. another wonderful post by fireball. do you ever do anything but try to delude yourself into thinking the accord is a sports car? I heard they were coming out with an accord SI for the 09 MY. :thumbsdow

[jblaust]

Sounds like somebody is mad that there accord is not the top dog on the block anymore.

[honda761]

I really want to test drive the 08 V6 6 speed. With that 3.5 in there. It cant be too much off the speed and excitment of a Acura TL-S can it? Maybe the type s is what .2 second faster? No way can you tell the difference, but you sure can when you are paying for it.

[chanke4252]

Sounds like somebody is mad that there accord is not the top dog on the block anymore.

haha, no, I'm not mad at all. I didn't buy my accord to be "top dog". I wouldn't have purchased an accord, of all cars, if that were my goal. I bought it to be a practical yet fun car, and it definitely has been. LOTS of cars are faster than my 7th gen, including the 8th gen. I will never debate that. The thing is that all of fireball's threads are about the same freaking thing, and usually quote numbers skewing his comparisons in favor of his car taking the best #'s for the 8th gen and the worst #'s for the vehicle being compared, and often compare the 8th gen to the evo in some way. He has racerboy syndrome and is obviously convinced that the 8th gen is a race car. Kind of reminds me of a guy with the handle "legionofone" who was pretty much convinced that any accord with a k-series engine was a race car too and that the TSX was the fastest car on earth. I'm really amazed that fireball hasn't made a viper vs. 8th gen thread. it started with the famed Accord SI thread about 6 months ago (you will probably be dumber after reading that thread), and has only gotten worse. I wouldn't expect you to be aware of this after only 30-something posts.

I'm assuming (I could be wrong) that this particular thread is more of a response to some criticism that the 8th gen received on the motor trend forums about the car not making a lot of power considering it's rated mpg. Specifically the accord was compared to the charger/300 that made more power and used less fuel according to the idiots over there. The thing about that criticism, however, is that it is coming from people who don't understand that the way that economy is rated changed and they are probably comparing the 8th gen to a car using a very different method of rating mpg. Checking the rating for the current charger, the 3.5L engine definitely makes 250hp and gets 17/24mpg. Most Honda engines still use less gas to make the same hp as most others. It's been that way for a while, and I don't see a company like chrysler doing better than what honda is currently doing any time soon. Bottom line, there is a reason they are on a motor trend forum (extra chromosomes).

[98AccordEX]

Sounds like somebody is mad that there accord is not the top dog on the block anymore.

Well, Fireball likes to quote articles from 2003 when the 7th Gen just came out instead of 2005-2007 after the Accord received several engine enhancements stoking the 3.0 V6 engine up to full boil. So chanke4252 has a better chance than Fireball is indicating should he choose to challenge a 8th Gen Accord.

[jblaust]

haha, no, I'm not mad at all. I didn't buy my accord to be "top dog". I wouldn't have purchased an accord, of all cars, if that were my goal. I bought it to be a practical yet fun car, and it definitely has been. LOTS of cars are faster than my 7th gen, including the 8th gen. I will never debate that. The thing is that all of fireball's threads are about the same freaking thing, and usually quote numbers skewing his comparisons in favor of his car taking the best #'s for the 8th gen and the worst #'s for the vehicle being compared, and often compare the 8th gen to the evo in some way. He has racerboy syndrome and is obviously convinced that the 8th gen is a race car. Kind of reminds me of a guy with the handle "legionofone" who was pretty much convinced that any accord with a k-series engine was a race car too and that the TSX was the fastest car on earth. I'm really amazed that fireball hasn't made a viper vs. 8th gen thread. it started with the famed Accord SI thread about 6 months ago (you will probably be dumber after reading that thread), and has only gotten worse. I wouldn't expect you to be aware of this after only 30-something posts.

I'm assuming (I could be wrong) that this particular thread is more of a response to some criticism that the 8th gen received on the motor trend forums about the car not making a lot of power considering it's rated mpg. Specifically the accord was compared to the charger/300 that made more power and used less fuel according to the idiots over there. The thing about that criticism, however, is that it is coming from people who don't understand that the way that economy is rated changed and they are probably comparing the 8th gen to a car using a very different method of rating mpg. Checking the rating for the current charger, the 3.5L engine definitely makes 250hp and gets 17/24mpg. Most Honda engines still use less gas to make the same hp as most others. It's been that way for a while, and I don't see a company like chrysler doing better than what honda is currently doing any time soon. Bottom line, there is a reason they are on a motor trend forum (extra chromosomes).


The independant dyno results I saw said that the V6 AUTO was a little dissapointing and didn't live up to the #'s that Honda has said it puts down (which is supposed to be the same as the 6 speed). However the 6 speed V6 lived up to the #'s almost perfectly. 268hp to the flywheel and 248 hp to the hubs. Not bad for an accord.

[jblaust]

I posted the dyno results in another thread here.

[chanke4252]

yah, there are some weird dynos out there. there was one that showed 268hp to the hubs, which was odd to say the least especially since that was what honda rated it at the crank. a few people were really excited about it and started quoting those numbers as fact when it was obviously messed up (corrected wrong or maybe the dyno was just malfunctioning or something). this was the same dyno that saw a civic si at somewhere above 200hp to the hubs. for some reason the lightbulb didn't switch on in a lot of peoples' heads though. there was another dyno of a different 6mt on temple of vtec that looked pretty good though. I'd like to see another dyno of an auto though. those #'s did seem a little low, but who knows, they could be accurate. hopefully that vcm stuff and the transmission doesn't actually sap that much power, but stranger things have happened. I'm anxious to see whether or not the 08's have any problem with 3rd gear popping out though. From what I've experienced in my car and other test-drives I really like the 6spd's tranny. a lot of people have bigger problems with it though. though, I think i'd rather take that extra umph and deal with the 3rd gear issue if the auto really does put such a gimped amount of power to the ground. though, maybe I would sing a different tune had the swap to gm syncromesh fm fluid not fixed my issues w/ it.

[jblaust]

Yeah the dyno results im talking about was the one of temple of vtec.

Now that your mention it I do have a little problem finding 3rd. It doesnt pop out once its in but its easy to miss 3rd if you arent thinking about it. If i make sure to guide it in its ok. If I just try to drive casual and dont think about it I have a tendancy to have to look for 3rd a little harder. You have this problem?

[chanke4252]

no, that sounds more like a driving style thing. I can always find third, however the problem that I had occasionally was fully engaging third. The shifter would slide through the gate, and if you weren't paying attention felt like it was fully engaged, but as soon as you let the clutch out it would pop back into neutral, or grind till you clutched back in (i leave my hand on the shifter). it's a problem that a lot of people have. some people only have it occasionally, some people have it constantly. it is an issue that honda knows about and is present on most, if not all of their 6spd transmissions (SI, S2000, TL are those that I know for sure), so I assume that it has carried over to the new accord 6mt. I only experienced it about once every couple of days, and mainly when the transmission was still cold. I'm guessing that improper downshifting techniques will probably aggravate the problem in many peoples' cases as it more than likely has something to do with the 3rd gear syncro.

a fix that worked for me was replacing the honda transmission fluid with the GM syncromesh friction modified transmission fluid. The bottle actually says "ACDelco", but it is the same stuff. Only the friction modified stuff has really actually solved peoples' problems long term, the non-friction modified stuff only fixes it for a few thousand miles apparently. honda was supposedly coming out with a fix for it on numerous occasions, but I have yet to see anything resembling any attempt at a fix other than the release of a slightly different transmission fluid, which sounds like it is just a lighter version of the standard honda transmission fluid and didn't solve the problem at all for most people. for some people the new fluid actually made grinding problems worse.

[jblaust]

That is the exact same issue I have with mine. I probably just described it wrong.

[chanke4252]

You can get the syncromesh f.m. fluid from hardtopguy.com. It works wonders. Change it and don't look back. I ordered 3 bottles, though I should have ordered 5 as the fill only took a hair under 2.5 bottles.

http://www.hardtopguy.com/store/product.php?productid=254&cat=0&bestseller

[jblaust]

its gear oil right?