Well I have lost complete faith in the dealers. I never had much faith in them in the first place but thinking that they should be following the rules it was a little better then a local shop. Well I had 4 tires and an alignment done on my father's 95 Accord back in Sept by Main Line Honda in Ardmore, PA. I changed his oil on Saturday (he doesn't put a lot of miles on the car) and when I went to rotate the tires, I knew right away that a nut was going to snap a stud. I've had too many experiences with incompetent mechanics to know when they will snap. Luckily it was on the rear and I was able to pop it out and put one in from Autozone as a temp. As many of you know, the front is a pain to get out as the hub needs to be pressed out.

Anyways I'll be going up to them today to have them give me a replacement for free of course, but I thought I would share this with the group. If I ever recommend going to the dealer again slap me in the face :nuts:

Do keep in mind that the ones that do the oil changes & tire rotations are usually "lube techs" & they just came from Walmart, JiffyLube, Costco, Sears & the like.:D

Make sure they note who did the rotation. It's the only way they have a chance of improving!

You'll get a kick out of this....So I went over there to get the replacement. I was as calm as I could be and explained the situation. Then the service guy has the nerve to tell me it was because of the age of the car. That's when I lost it (again I kept my cool and didn't shout). I told him that this situation only happens one of two ways 1) if the lug is not put on correctly or 2) it is overtorqued. I had to get their service manage to approve the change. I told the manager that I tried to be nice to the advisor but him telling customer a lie is inexcusable. I wasn't asking anything additional then the two parts.

I've been rotating tires for years by hand tightening them and then using my torque wrench and this has never happened to me…..I need to cool off a bit as my blood pressure is through the roof :furious:

I personally am a "lube tech". It's not our incompetence it's the equipment. We have to use impact guns and the majority of the time are being yelled at to "hurry up get this car out" type deal. I try to thread the lugs on as far as I can before hitting them with the impact gun but there is only so much we can do. If you are going to get mad at someone don't get mad at the "lube tech" take it up with management. I've seen countless studs/bolts screwed up due to the impact gun.

I've seen countless studs/bolts screwed up due to the impact gun.

I have too. With over 20 years personal experience I will agree that in "unskilled hands" an impact gun will do major damage.


I1:)

I'm not questioning you about your service, because you are the exception to the rule. I'm complaining about those people who don't even bother to hand tighten the lugs before using the impact gun. I think the majority of the problem occur from because if the lug isn't on correctly when the gun is used it is already too late and that lug is toast.

I also don't doubt it is management's fault because they are bringing in too many cars in a given day and they don't have enough people to service them which turns into a circus. I don't even visit this dealer more then 2-3 times a year at most and I could see that they were rushing people in and out so I can imagine what the service bays are like. This is why I drove out the furthest Honda dealer away from the city that I could get to for my latest alignment on our 99 Accord.

Lesson learned...next time I need tires I pull them off, bring them to the tire shop and then put them on myself. I also wanted to post this information so that the people on the group do not get suckered into paying for something that the shop screwed up in the first place. I could only imagine what this would cost.

All this because of one dealer?

Come on now, as frustrating as it is, it can happen anywhere. :yes:

It does happen everywhere.... dealers, & anywhere else that puts lugs on with the air tools. It's actually not recommended to do it that way.... but everyone does.

You have about 15-20 minutes to move on to the next car, as I understand it. That's for finding, lifting, changing, rotating, & parking.

I've sat in the car at the Mall & heard the Sears service air tools go "zing" & "rattattat". All on the lugs. Of course, I've also known 2 cars that had a wheel fall off on it's way home from THAT Sears. :dunno: If I had to choose. I'd take the boogered up lug rather than the whole wheel falling off!!:D

They should not have lied!!

Accidents happen. They should've simply given you an apology along with the parts.

Call me OCD, but I'm in the habit of driving straight home after anyone's had my wheels off, immediately breaking the lugs loose and then re-tightening them by hand.

For my money it's the only way to know the wheels are on right. (And I check them again a week later by trying to tighten them in case they worked loose.)

Accidents happen. They should've simply given you an apology along with the parts.

Exactly...I wasn't even looking for an apology, just the parts.

At our local les schwab we've had to tell the "mechanics" how many pounds to torque the lugs too more than once....they actually warped the rotor on my moms 96 Taurus SHO by tightening a few lugs too tight.

I have too. With over 20 years personal experience I will agree that in "unskilled hands" an impact gun will do major damage.


I1:)

I will agree with that, there is a gentleman I work with who knows absolutely nothing about cars and since he started (same time as me) he has stripped probably 8-10 studs in about 3 months. He is no longer allowed to do rotates, personally I can't even believe they have kept him. I wouldn't want someone knows absolutely nothing about cars working on mine. Our manager is pretty good about teaching people how to do it correctly, finger tightening all the way down (which is what I do) then hitting them with the gun. That one kid is an exception, I don't think the automotive industry is his calling. One piece of advice would be to stand there while they are doing it. I know then you look like a jerk or whatever but if you just ask the tech nicely to hand tighten the nuts on before he uses an impact wrench I doubt there would be any objections. I love talking to customers about their cars because I know I would want to find out from the tech what is going on and not the service adviser who only sees $$.

I personally am a "lube tech". It's not our incompetence it's the equipment. We have to use impact guns and the majority of the time are being yelled at to "hurry up get this car out" type deal. I try to thread the lugs on as far as I can before hitting them with the impact gun but there is only so much we can do. If you are going to get mad at someone don't get mad at the "lube tech" take it up with management. I've seen countless studs/bolts screwed up due to the impact gun.

do you work at a Honda dealership? if so do you have to have any background in automotive work to get a job? i know a thing or two about cars, and i am a very fast learner. i need a new job, and if i can't get one at the computer store next to my apartments, i was going to apply at the Honda dealership, that is not to far of a drive from my apartments.


i hate people working on my car, i normally do the stand, and watch them work thing. not just because i am worried, but if i don't know what there doing, i want to know how to do it:D

I personally work for one of the biggest ford dealers in the state. They don't "require" you to have training but I sat down and talked with the manager about what I know and what I want to learn and he was really cool about all of it. I've seen advisers for the quicklane that come in and no very little about the actual workings of a car, kind of scary. I'm not sure about honda and what their requirements are. I'm sure it has to do with which ever dealer you go to. Even if you do start as just a lube tech I've seen many guys move up very quickly to service advisers to management. In fact the manager of the service department and quicklane is only about 24 and he makes pretty good money (Around 100k) and never went to college. Oh and he started in the quicklane as a "lube tech" when he was 17.

If the lugs were to be threaded on by hand first then with a gun at the correct spec, there wouldn't be problems. Since the guns don't get calibrated every so often, they aren't precise. Impact guns can warp rotors, which is why I do not use them for my wheels.

Not to put anyone down in any sort of way, I may be just more mechanically inclined than others, but this is why I NEVER let anyone work on my car. By NEVER, I mean my car in the 7 years of ownership has seen a mechanic ONLY for an alignment. Before I attempt to fix problems, I read the Honda manual and Haynes manual. I've replaced everything there is on my car, with the help of my brother and my garage :thumbsup:

INot to put anyone down in any sort of way, I may be just more mechanically inclined than others, but this is why I NEVER let anyone work on my car. By NEVER, I mean my car in the 7 years of ownership has seen a mechanic ONLY for an alignment. Before I attempt to fix problems, I read the Honda manual and Haynes manual. I've replaced everything there is on my car, with the help of my brother and my garage :thumbsup:

It's great to be mechanically inclined but using the dealer pays off if you have a late model Honda. People who have complete dealer service histories are much more likely to get Honda's support when things go amiss out of warrantees. - Things like transmissions, emissions components, electrical stuff etc.

My 96 Accord has a almost full dealer/honda specialist service history with all my documentation. I've had repairs done at no cost to me 3 times since my warranty expired, the last being at 88k miles. My aunts Accord got bought back by Honda because she had records of having the transmission serviced at the dealer and they even gave her some cash to get into a new car.

Not to mention, when you go to sell it, good service records can make a huge difference from prospective buyers or even if you're going to trade. I recently had my Accord appraised and got a written offer of 3450 and then showed them my maintenance binder and the dealer went to 4k. - Above book's trade value.

There are plenty of good Honda Dealers out there, you just have to give it a chance. - My suggestion is to always start with an oil change. A dealer's ability to handle something that minute tells you a lot about them, and especially how they treat you as you come and go. :yes:

I think it's time for a recommended dealers thread!