Ok, MY particular opinion is.... if I lease a car ever three years, I have to give it back, I don't "own" it after the lease is up, and I'm not going to have any iota of a return on my money. I financed because, I gain ownership in the vehicle, I can at least sell it for something one day, or I can give it to my son. :D

I'd like to read different opinions though, very curious.:)

Lease - Good if you own business so you can right off interest. Also a way to drive more expensive cars for less monthly payments.

Purchase - Better bang for your buck but lacks the advantages of lease for above situations.

I always prefer purchasing over leasing since I like to own my $hiT! :D

Lease - Good if you own business so you can right off interest. Also a way to drive more expensive cars for less monthly payments.

Purchase - Better bang for your buck but lacks the advantages of lease for above situations.

I always prefer purchasing over leasing since I like to own my $hiT! :D

I know what you mean, good points about the lease advantages "IF" one owns a business.

i would much rather buy. leasing is just paying for the privledge to drive someone else's car. plus you get mileage restrictions which kind of suck.

Moved to General Drive subforum.

"Buying vs. Leasing" all depends on the individuals needs/requirements/preferences/objectives/etc'. There's always a rhyme to the reason, or madness! :D

I haven't had the need yet in life to lease. If the situation presented itself in the future, of-course I'd consider it!

Here's an interesting example...

My friend is considering a brand-new Aston Martin V8 Vantage Roadster lease for $1700/month w/ $3.5k down (36month total: ~$61k). So, after 3yrs lease, he'd be $61k less in the pocketbook, but no more responsibility/liability.

If he bought it, it'd be ~$135K + gas-guzzler tax (~$3k) + state sales tax (~$11k), totaling $149k out-of-his-pocket + 7.5% financing (~$11k), meaning he'd owe $160k. The 3yr residual value is $82.5k (even that is optimistic, sighhh). So $160k - $82.5 = $77.5k in money for him to own for 3yrs.

So, in this case, leasing saves $16.5k over the span of 3yrs vs. outright ownership.

(I believe leasing also includes scheduled maint'/service, not entirely sure).

If he plans to keep it for more than 3yrs, then the depreciation starts to taper off & the ownership numbers improve.

Make'th sense? :cool:

I just leased my first vehicle about 2 months ago, and am content with my decision. It was leased through our LLC. It was a terrific deal.

It was leased right before the current meltdown, and Nissan had just introduced it's first (and maybe only for a while) subvented lease on the 2009 Murano.

We have never leased a car before, and only financed one in all the years we've been married (18+ years)... and even then we only did it because Nissan offered basically free money (0.9%) for 36 months (on top of a $1500 rebate for the first and only time on the Pathy). This allowed us to leave the money in savings, have NMAC payed each month through auto bill-pay, but still have the cash there in case of an emergency. We actually paid it off early before we moved to our new house in 2006... just wanted to start off fresh again. We have never considered leasing before simply because we have always assumed we would keep the car longer than a lease term... even though that didn't always happen.

I plan on keeping the Murano through it's 39 month lease (obviously)... no longer. It will always be under warranty and all sched. maint. is included in my deal. I am too old and busy to have any interest in making the Murano "my own"... aka mods of any kind. My Murano has every feature available. I just drive it, fill it with gas, and enjoy the ride. I still will keep it as spotless as the cars we own just because we are very clean and organized people. It will be a great car for someone when I turn it in, for sure.

That's it for me!:)

"Buying vs. Leasing" all depends on the individuals needs/requirements/preferences/objectives/etc'. There's always a rhyme to the reason, or madness! :D

I haven't had the need yet in life to lease. If the situation presented itself in the future, of-course I'd consider it!

Here's an interesting example...

My friend is considering a brand-new Aston Martin V8 Vantage Roadster lease for $1700/month w/ $3.5k down (36month total: ~$61k). So, after 3yrs lease, he'd be $61k less in the pocketbook, but no more responsibility/liability.

If he bought it, it'd be ~$135K + gas-guzzler tax (~$3k) + state sales tax (~$11k), totaling $149k out-of-his-pocket + 7.5% financing (~$11k), meaning he'd owe $160k. The 3yr residual value is $82.5k (even that is optimistic, sighhh). So $160k - $82.5 = $77.5k in money for him to own for 3yrs.

So, in this case, leasing saves $16.5k over the span of 3yrs vs. outright ownership.

(I believe leasing also includes scheduled maint'/service, not entirely sure).

If he plans to keep it for more than 3yrs, then the depreciation starts to taper off & the ownership numbers improve.

Make'th sense? :cool:

MOST high end premium cars are leased, probably 75% or so.........:yes:

I just leased my first vehicle about 2 months ago, and am content with my decision. It was leased through our LLC. It was a terrific deal.

It was leased right before the current meltdown, and Nissan had just introduced it's first (and maybe only for a while) subvented lease on the 2009 Murano.

We have never leased a car before, and only financed one in all the years we've been married (18+ years)... and even then we only did it because Nissan offered basically free money (0.9%) for 36 months (on top of a $1500 rebate for the first and only time on the Pathy). This allowed us to leave the money in savings, have NMAC payed each month through auto bill-pay, but still have the cash there in case of an emergency. We actually paid it off early before we moved to our new house in 2006... just wanted to start off fresh again. We have never considered leasing before simply because we have always assumed we would keep the car longer than a lease term... even though that didn't always happen.

I plan on keeping the Murano through it's 39 month lease (obviously)... no longer. It will always be under warranty and all sched. maint. is included in my deal. I am too old and busy to have any interest in making the Murano "my own"... aka mods of any kind. My Murano has every feature available. I just drive it, fill it with gas, and enjoy the ride. I still will keep it as spotless as the cars we own just because we are very clean and organized people. It will be a great car for someone when I turn it in, for sure.

That's it for me!:)

Even if it wasn't such a good deal, you bought it through your business, and the writeoffs are good for business use vehicles........:thmsup:

FWIW, my friend in MA just leased a new '08 EX-L Pilot back in Jan/Feb for the interest rate of 0.72% (Money Factor of .0003) w/ zero-down for an out-the-door monthly-payment of $439 for 12k miles per year, blah-bla-bah. . .

He's one of the sharpest/stingiest guys I know in terms of deals/etc', so I'm sure there's some reasoning/rationale` to this actions. . .

(perhaps the post-lease residual value will be 'bunk, making it favorable for re-acquisition?)

MOST high end premium cars are leased, probably 75% or so.........And then there's people like me who wait till those very vehicles (premium/luxury-cars & high-end sports-cars) bottom-out in terms of initial depreciation & let the original owners take the hit on the uber-pricey high-end spec'd model w/ the additional tasty options/accessories... :D

(waiting for the MB CLS or Acura '09 RL 'tech' to drop like their 'hot! :naughty:)

FWIW, my friend in MA just leased a new '08 EX-L Pilot back in Jan/Feb for the interest rate of 0.72% (Money Factor of .0003) w/ zero-down for an out-the-door monthly-payment of $439 for 12k miles per year, blah-bla-bah. . .

He's one of the sharpest/stingiest guys I know in terms of deals/etc', so I'm sure there's some reasoning/rationale` to this actions. . .

(perhaps the post-lease residual value will be 'bunk, making it favorable for re-acquisition?)

Maybe, do you know the residual pecentage number? I remember my last least, a 2003 Buick Rendevous. I got a 1% money factor, a 50% residual, got security deposit and down payment waived, and applied a $3000 GM card rebate to the cap cost of invoice less dealer cash of $1500. My payment was $249 + tax for a loaded AWD Rendevous, 15,000 miles a year. Friends of mine thought I was lying.........:lmao:

Unfortunately, the bottom dropped off of their resale value, so I didn't buy it out, because overpaying for my own trade seems foolish.......:yes:

And then there's people like me who wait till those very vehicles (premium/luxury-cars & high-end sports-cars) bottom-out in terms of initial depreciation & let the original owners take the hit on the uber-pricey high-end spec'd model w/ the additional tasty options/accessories... :D

(waiting for the MB CLS or Acura '09 RL 'tech' to drop like their 'hot! :naughty:)[/QUOTE]

^ on new-car leases, why is the MSRP value negotiated/discounted (you mentioned your GM rebate, the dealer cash-incentive, and other applicable discounts from the list-price, etc')?

Isn't the monthly lease-payment what matters (what they've advertised, ie. $299/month, $399/month, $1699/month, etc')?

I'm totally new to the finesse's of negotiating leases, I just know of the tax-benefits in certain scenarios. . .

^ on new-car leases, why is the MSRP value negotiated/discounted (you mentioned your GM rebate, the dealer cash-incentive, and other applicable discounts from the list-price, etc')?

Isn't the monthly lease-payment what matters (what they've advertised, ie. $299/month, $399/month, $1699/month, etc')?

I'm totally new to the finesse's of negotiating leases, I just know of the tax-benefits in certain scenarios. . .

The ads you see on TV are for most but not all cars are "loss leaders". You get the base model of something for a low lease payment. Of course, most folks want more goodies, so the price escalates quickly. Typically dealers will "ballpark" you at $15 per $500 of higher MSRP, or $30 per $1000 of higher MSRP car. That ia a good-sized bump.

Dealers will close on payment on a lease, and then work the terms to fit. When I used to be an F&I manager eons ago, we would "desk" a lease deal at $3000 over MSRP for 30 months, and work from there. Then, you can back into the lease with rate reductions, longer term, or money down.

Pretty much ALL leases can be negotiated, although it's harder on the low price loss leaders because all th gross for the dealer is gone.........:yes:

About 60% of all folks I know leased NEVER negotiated, they were pure payment buyers. One Jeep dealer in town used to push 60 month leases, and they made a killing on them........:paranoid:

Ahhh'... I see, I see! So the $399 TL lease or some-other somewhat attractive lease advertised ($XXX/month w/ $X,XXX down for 36months / 12k miles) are for specific models in-stock. Gotcha.

Some peoples want their sports & winter-package, premium-sound, active/adaptive cruise-control, parking-assist, and so forth... lol!

So, if the '08 TL 'base' has MSRP of $35k, and lease is $399/month (36months) + $3,500 down. What can actually be negotiated? I'm just curious! Busting-heads over the MSRP can lower the lease-payment (ie. if the discounted/negotiated price is $27.5k)? I know down-payments can be negotiated/discounted.

Leasing is not going to be around for much longer IMO so if it fits your lifestyle and you don't mind essentially tossing $ into something you will never own, go for it! There are some definite pros to leasing but some definite cons also, and for many people, the cons will outweigh the pros at the end of the day (whether they choose to acknowledge that may be another story, though).

Like others have said it all depends on your lifestyle and what you are looking for in a vehicle.

We always buy our cars since we keep them for a long time. Actually, our 02 sedan and 06 sedan were both two year old lease returns when we bought them. I'm thinking that this is a pretty good way to buy cars.

Ahhh'... I see, I see! So the $399 TL lease or some-other somewhat attractive lease advertised ($XXX/month w/ $X,XXX down for 36months / 12k miles) are for specific models in-stock. Gotcha.

Some peoples want their sports & winter-package, premium-sound, active/adaptive cruise-control, parking-assist, and so forth... lol!

So, if the '08 TL 'base' has MSRP of $35k, and lease is $399/month (36months) + $3,500 down. What can actually be negotiated? I'm just curious! Busting-heads over the MSRP can lower the lease-payment (ie. if the discounted/negotiated price is $27.5k)? I know down-payments can be negotiated/discounted.

You can negotiate any lease, the ones that are manufacturer's specials have no gross left in them for the dealers, so you won't have much luck. If you find the car you really want, the dealer will try to make up the "loss leader" gross by sticking you with a MUCH higher lease payment.

A simple way to get their attention is to say: "If I can get the car I want for those same terms, I'll buy it. Then the negotiation begins. Stick to your guns on term, the EASIEST way for the dealer to make a lot of money is to extend the term 6 months to a year........:yes:

I'm leasing my car, I have 5 months left. I dont feel its a bad deal at all. I got 2.19 money factor, every month my buyout is lower. Feels like financing to me, with financing you dont own the car either until the last payment. I have a buyout of 16,xxx dollars next March, going to buy it out.

personally, the only benefit of leasing is that you get a spiffy, brand new car every 2 or 3 years. if you have some money to burn, it makes sense because you are forced to lease a new car (which you want) every 3 years, and don't have to deal with trading your old car in.

I personally like to buy rather then lease even though its not advantages to how I go through cars. Sense November 05' This is my 3rd car each time I was upside down on my previous car because zero down and the APR of 4.9 % and less I was able to secure. So leasing would be better however I have a hard time buying a lease as its an expensive car rental w/ strict and expensive limits ie: Mileage why have it if you cant drive it? I will not buy a used car as I don't know how the prior owner treated it as I can only think of how I drive my cars the term" Drive it like you stole it comes to mind." But all and all I doubt I will change my opinion of Lease Vs. Buying even if I loose my @$$ call me crazy......

I always buy. Even the company I work for has stopped leasing our company cars and trucks. They either out right purchase them or give you a good allowance or mileage with perks.

So I use my own car and truck. Then use the mileage they pay and other little perks I get.

I personally like to buy rather then lease even though its not advantages to how I go through cars. Sense November 05' This is my 3rd car each time I was upside down on my previous car because zero down and the APR of 4.9 % and less I was able to secure. So leasing would be better however I have a hard time buying a lease as its an expensive car rental w/ strict and expensive limits ie: Mileage why have it if you cant drive it? I will not buy a used car as I don't know how the prior owner treated it as I can only think of how I drive my cars the term" Drive it like you stole it comes to mind." But all and all I doubt I will change my opinion of Lease Vs. Buying even if I loose my @$$ call me crazy......

You can build in mileage for 15-18 cents a mile. GM was being really tricky on their leases, only allowing 800 miles a month while extending the lease from 36 to 39 months......what a crock.

my wife drives 9000 miles a year, so we used to lease because she didn;t drive much. However, I currently own both Hondas now.........:thmsup:

Here's an interesting example...

My friend is considering a brand-new Aston Martin V8 Vantage Roadster lease for $1700/month w/ $3.5k down (36month total: ~$61k). So, after 3yrs lease, he'd be $61k less in the pocketbook, but no more responsibility/liability.

If he bought it, it'd be ~$135K + gas-guzzler tax (~$3k) + state sales tax (~$11k), totaling $149k out-of-his-pocket + 7.5% financing (~$11k), meaning he'd owe $160k. The 3yr residual value is $82.5k (even that is optimistic, sighhh). So $160k - $82.5 = $77.5k in money for him to own for 3yrs.

So, in this case, leasing saves $16.5k over the span of 3yrs vs. outright ownership.

You make a very very very good point here. For my Accord, I bought it as I plan on keeping it a long time...but its constantly on my mind to get a BMW in a few years, as a few friends have them, and I'm always in love with the 335 each time I drive one. When I look at the numbers, it would cost me here in Canada upwards of $65K with taxes to get one, yet if I leased in the end I would only be paying between half to three quarters that amount (EDIT: in fact, just did a quick calc and I'd be saving around $25K or 40%..and thats if I bought the car outright without financing)

I guess too a lot does depend on your last point...does the dealer cover maintenance. I'd hate to think of what an Austin costs in repairs...as I know what BMWs cost here and its appalling. With a lease, if you want to keep trading in/up with a car like that...you can lease it for the term and technically "save" on the difference (like the 16.5K you mentioned), plus the car goes back before the warranty/free maintenance is up, meaning you never have a repair bill (knock on wood).

Again all this would be a mut point if cars maintained their value...but unless you buy a classic the only way to go is down lol.

Heres some facts.
You can do anything in a leased car that you would do in any other "bought" car, as long as it does not VOID the WARRANTY.
You want a body kit? SURE. Just take it off before you turn the car in.
That sorta stuff....

I've owned my first 3 cars. After being upside down on the last 2 (after trading them in) I decided I will NEVER BUY AGAIN. I will ALWAYS want a NEW car every 2-3years. NO QUESTION. I want full warranty, and piece of mind knowing that I am the only person to drive the car.

IMO dealers run the biggest scams with leases, because the majority of people just look for a "MONTHLY PAYMENT" They have no idea about anything behind it. Which is why you always negotiate the price of the car, THEN lease based off that number. But you should always research research research before you get into leasing.

Also, you should NEVER put money down on a lease. God forbid you drive off that dealer's lot and someone creams you. You will lose EVERY PENNY that you put into that car. (The same goes for BUYING, but in the case of buying your ****ED!) So the insurance company declares the lease a total loss, and you walk away. You owe NOTHING and you get nothing. Because the majority of leases come with a mandatory GAP Insurance.

You bought the car for $30k. You drove it 5 miles. Now it's worth 25k. Because you leased with GAP insurance, and put $0 down you are out NOTHING. But if you bought the car, the insurance will typically pay for $25k and now you typically owe the remaining $5. (Or if you put money down, you are out that money)



Basically, you will hear people LOVE leasing, like I do, and you will hear people tell you that you are a moron for leasing. THEY are the morons for saying that because you need to determine what is appropriate for YOU. Leasing is not for everyone. Just like buying is not for everyone.
I will always lease because I want new cars with no obligation. Some people want to drive cars until their ****ing wheels fall off. It's all how it fits you and your lifestyle (and what you can afford) ((Typically you can get a more expensive car for less/month.)


My case: 07 EXL V6 Accord. $299/mo for 36 month. Signed and drove. Not 1 penny down, not first month, no security, no taxes, nothing. 299/mo. (cuz everything was bundled into my pmt) MSRP was like $29k.ish. I got the leased base price around $23.

Ah, just read someone else's post....

Since I leased a Honda, Honda's do not come with maintenance plans like BMW's and such.

So over 3 years. I'll pay $299x36month, plus oil changes, tire rotations and other basic maintenance. Honda gives a $1500 lease turn-in leeway, so I won't need to pay for new tires or anything like that.

(The deal gets sweet when you go more expensive and it comes with maintenance plans)

Also, YOU customize everything in your lease. If you see BMW 325 advertised for $299/mo you can bet that theres a catch.
Some catches are.... Cap Cost Reduction (NEVER do this because you will always lose the money in the event of a total loss) + Security (if needed) + extra money if you do not qualify for their highest tier of credit + low low mileage.
So you just tell them how many miles you use a year, they run credit and they give you real numbers (at the dealer) That $299/mo for a 3series (which is prolly the BASE model with no features) will quickly inflate to $500+

Hmm, sounds like a good deal but i've always been leary of having to pay for excessive mileage over my contract.:paranoid: Does that $1,500. leeway you mentioned cover excessive mileage? I buy cars to DRIVE and ENJOY them, not park them and brag about how little mileage I put on them while I pay hundreds of dollars a month. Therefore, I tend to put a lot of miles on my cars, thus MY justification for buy versus lease. I think it's a good option for some though...not all.:thmsup:

Hmm, sounds like a good deal but i've always been leary of having to pay for excessive mileage over my contract.:paranoid: Does that $1,500. leeway you mentioned cover excessive mileage? I buy cars to DRIVE and ENJOY them, not park them and brag about how little mileage I put on them while I pay hundreds of dollars a month. Therefore, I tend to put a lot of miles on my cars, thus MY justification for buy versus lease. I think it's a good option for some though...not all.:thmsup:

MOST premium imports are leased. I have a friend who drives an M5. His lease payment is $2300 a month. He has been leasing different cars every 3 years or so for 20 years and seems quite happy. He NEVER puts anything down.

MOST premium imports are leased. I have a friend who drives an M5. His lease payment is $2300 a month. He has been leasing different cars every 3 years or so for 20 years and seems quite happy. He NEVER puts anything down.

$2,300. a month??? That's more than my mortgage!:screwy: At $2,300./mo times 20 years, that's roughly $5.2 million That'd do wonders for my 401k.

$2,300. a month??? That's more than my mortgage!:screwy: At $2,300./mo times 20 years, that's roughly $5.2 million That'd do wonders for my 401k.

I think cars cost less 20 years ago. For instance, he got a Porsche once for $375 a month.........:notworthy

FWIW, the '05 Acura NSX had a MSRP of $89k (no additional options/accessories available). It was routinely offered at & purchased for ~$81k, and there was the Acura $799/month lease + state sales tax (36 months, zero-down, 7.5k miles/month)


Offer valid only on approved credit by Honda Financial Services through participating dealers. Honda Financial Services' standard credit criteria apply. See your Acura dealer for details. Featured lease for 2004 NSX (Model# NA2164PKW). MSRP $89,765.00 (includes destination). Actual net capital cost $83,040.24. DEALER PARTICIPATION MAY AFFECT ACTUAL PAYMENT. Taxes, license, title, registration, documentation fees, options and insurance extra. Total monthly payments $28,764.00. Option to purchase at lease end $60,142.55. Lessee responsible for maintenance, excessive wear/tear and 15¢/mile over 7,500 miles/year. Lease rates subject to change without prior notice.
Current market-value for an '05 NSX w/ ~22.5k miles is ~$72,500'ish (offered @ ~$67.5k will sell in minutes & offered @ ~$77.5k would require time & a discerning buyer).

So, in this case, owning would've prevailed.

Purchased: $81,000 (discounted from $89,765) + 8.25% sales tax ($6,683) + $135 title-reg'/license-plate + 5% APR for 5yrs/60months ($4,391) = $92,209

Current value (w/ ~22.5k miles): ~$72,500 (+/- depending on season/location/color-combo'/mileage)

Depreciation: $19,709/36months = owning -> $547/month vs. leasing -> $869/month ($799 lease-payment + $66/month sales-tax @ 8.25% & one-time $135 title-reg'/license-fee = $869/month x 36months = $31,284)

A difference of $322/month in favor of ownership over lease, as well as some long-term equity in the vehicle (depending on rate of depreciation, or lack-off even) if owned.

Service/maint' is regular fluid-changes & major tune-up @ 7yrs/105k.

Now, buying after leasing would be interesting as the purchase price is ~$60,143 + 8.25% sales tax ($4,962) + 5% APR ($3255) = $68,360. The lease was $869/month x 36months = $31,284, so that plus $68,360 = $99,644 (grand-total for leasing + purchase after lease), whereas buying from the start was $92,209 out-the-door... so $7,435 LESS to own vs. lease & then buy! :cool:

For high-end/sports-car, a great purchase a few years ago. But, long-term value, can't be ascertained due to economy/market/etc'. . .

You asked about the mileage thing....

Typically when you are quoted a price for a lease they give you a price based on 12k miles/year. So a 3 year lease would be 3yr/36k miles.
You need to estimate how many miles you are going to use. (Look at what you've done in the past)

In HONDA: you should estimate slightly higher if you want to avoid excess charges. I took 12k/mi year. I track my mileage on a website (along with gas and maintennce, just my version of OCD...... www.ownersite.com)
Based on my current mileage they predict I will exceed my 36k allotment, and be charged $300. (based on 10c mile extra) That excess is NOT included in the $1500 allowance from Honda. But this is another thing you have to look at when leasing, how much extra is the additional miles. Mine are 10c/mile. I think it's typical for Honda, but it could differ.
When you lease, you tell them how many miles you want per year and you will pay a lot LESS up front. I could have changed to about 15000 miles a year for only about $20 more a month in payment. You can typically select whatever you WANT as mileage, it will only adjust your car payment (up or down) If you only use 8k/miles you can do that, if you need 20k/yr you can do that too!!!

OTHER LEASING COMPANIES: The lease described above is typical for many auto leases. I've found that some companies, including BMW (which is how I know about this) allow you to be flexible with your lease mileage. This is what they told me at BMW. You can get a car with whatever mileage you want. Let's say you choose 12,000. A year later you realize that you are going over in mileage. At the halfway point through your lease you can PURCHASE additional miles at a reduced price. (i.e. 5,000 miles @ 10c = $500) NOW Let's say at the end of this lease you didn't use all your miles. They will REFUND you for the miles you did not use. GOOD DEAL huh?

I don't know what other companies do this, but I would assume BMW isn't alone, so many other high ends.

BTW, I'm not tooting my own horn, but I'm quite knowledgeable about the leasing process and the details in it, so feel free to PM me if you need anything else........

Never fleece a car...If you cannot afford to purchase it...you need to look at a lower priced car...period...

Never fleece a car...If you cannot afford to purchase it...you need to look at a lower priced car...period...

Tell that to all the people who could, in the last few years, in your words "afford" to shell out $30-$40-$50K for an SUV either in cash or by financing it. They are ****ed if they need or want to sell it now for whatever reason... they are upside down by sometimes as much as $15,000. But, those people who instead leased the same vehicle are now able to just throw the keys at the dealer while they run away from their turned in lease as fast as humanly possible. They'll let the manufacturer figure out how to sell the un-sellable.

A lot of those leases were heavily subvented, so they are much better off than the guy who has to try and sell his, let's say, Explorer. That guy might still owe $22,000 after 2 years and it's value is in the low teens (or worse!:yes:). He can't just turn that sucker in. He is royally stuck with it for (almost) eternity (or come up with a butt-load of cash).

The whole point may be moot since the domestics won't be leasing in any way for quite a while (if ever) and Toyota, Honda, Nissan, BMW, Mercedes, VW, etc. will continue to subvent their leases for those who have stellar credit... and can afford the luxury of a lease

I wonder how many who hate leasing so much are renting their apartments/houses? Why not just live with mommy and daddy (or a cardboard box) until you have enough to just pay cash and buy a house? Why throw your money away on owning nothing (since you obviously can't afford a house with the same square footage as your rental)? I'm only using your logic.

Oh, and make sure not to get a mortgage either, since paying in cash for something is the only way to go.

Realistic?

Uh... Nope.:rolleyes:

Tell that to all the people who could, in the last few years, in your words "afford" to shell out $30-$40-$50K for an SUV either in cash or by financing it. They are ****ed if they need or want to sell it now for whatever reason... they are upside down by sometimes as much as $15,000. But, those people who instead leased the same vehicle are now able to just throw the keys at the dealer while they run away from their turned in lease as fast as humanly possible. They'll let the manufacturer figure out how to sell the un-sellable.

I can't imagine paying $50,000 for a new Tahoe now. I had the chance to buy a 2006 Escalade with 35,000 miles for $18000..........:notworthy

A lot of those leases were heavily subvented, so they are much better off than the guy who has to try and sell his, let's say, Explorer. That guy might still owe $22,000 after 2 years and it's value is in the low teens (or worse!:yes:). He can't just turn that sucker in. He is royally stuck with it for (almost) eternity (or come up with a butt-load of cash).

The days if the subvented leases are waning........

The whole point may be moot since the domestics won't be leasing in any way for quite a while (if ever) and Toyota, Honda, Nissan, BMW, Mercedes, VW, etc. will continue to subvent their leases for those who have stellar credit... and can afford the luxury of a lease

Agreed.......

I wonder how many who hate leasing so much are renting their apartments/houses? Why not just live with mommy and daddy (or a cardboard box) until you have enough to just pay cash and buy a house? Why throw your money away on owning nothing (since you obviously can't afford a house with the same square footage as your rental)? I'm only using your logic.

They listen to Dateline too much. MANY high end premium cars would NOT be sold without leases.

They listen to Dateline too much. MANY high end premium cars would NOT be sold without leases.Isn't Dateline more-so Chris Hansen & pedo-bear stuff, whereas Suzie Orman, the local evening news, and others are more about the leasing high-jinx'es, etc'? :D

Isn't Dateline more-so Chris Hansen & pedo-bear stuff, whereas Suzie Orman, the local evening news, and others are more about the leasing high-jinx'es, etc'? :D

Well, kinda a figure of speech........what I meant was when someone issues a blanket statement that "leases suck", I wonder the following:

1)How many of them have actually leased a car, ever.

2)How well they can articulate HOW they suck, exactly.

:lmao::lmao:

Yea... as w/ buying, leasing has it's pro's & con's all dependent on the potential leasee's needs/requirements.

Pity it's next to impossible find someone who leases Ferrari F430 Scuderia's & Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera's... :D (that'd be a nice dilemma to be in, right?)

Tell that to all the people who could, in the last few years, in your words "afford" to shell out $30-$40-$50K for an SUV either in cash or by financing it. They are ****ed if they need or want to sell it now for whatever reason... they are upside down by sometimes as much as $15,000. But, those people who instead leased the same vehicle are now able to just throw the keys at the dealer while they run away from their turned in lease as fast as humanly possible. They'll let the manufacturer figure out how to sell the un-sellable.

A lot of those leases were heavily subvented, so they are much better off than the guy who has to try and sell his, let's say, Explorer. That guy might still owe $22,000 after 2 years and it's value is in the low teens (or worse!:yes:). He can't just turn that sucker in. He is royally stuck with it for (almost) eternity (or come up with a butt-load of cash).

The whole point may be moot since the domestics won't be leasing in any way for quite a while (if ever) and Toyota, Honda, Nissan, BMW, Mercedes, VW, etc. will continue to subvent their leases for those who have stellar credit... and can afford the luxury of a lease

I wonder how many who hate leasing so much are renting their apartments/houses? Why not just live with mommy and daddy (or a cardboard box) until you have enough to just pay cash and buy a house? Why throw your money away on owning nothing (since you obviously can't afford a house with the same square footage as your rental)? I'm only using your logic.

Oh, and make sure not to get a mortgage either, since paying in cash for something is the only way to go.

Realistic?

Uh... Nope.:rolleyes:
Your statements are so far off the mark I'm not even sure where to begin...

Your statements are so far off the mark I'm not even sure where to begin...

Give it a try...........:wave:

It all comes done to YOUR personal plan and the specifics about cash flow. In both leasing and renting situation there are trade-offs and benefits.

Closed-end lease: Less cash flow = Less monthly payments and in general with a shorter, fixed term (commitment) that you can walk away from at the end. The risks may include: early termination penalties, wear and tear, mileage, possible higher insurance, etc…

Financing: In general, requires higher cash flow with longer commitment when compared to leasing options. You own the asset at the end of the term.

Pay cash: Up-front payment, own asset.

Based on a monthly budget which option works for YOU? In the grand scheme of things where do you want your money to go? If you lease you get nothing more than the benefit of using the vehicle for the term of the agreement. If you finance you own the vehicle at the end, but, you have cash committed to the purchase plus interest over the agreed term. If you pay in cash you have committed cash equal to the purchase price one time, up front.

With financing you could invest a portion of the upfront cash and make more than the interest paid over the term. If you have a loan of 1.9% for example it is very possible to invest with a greater return over 3-4 years. At the end of the term you may have the investment plus any gains and the vehicle (asset). Your cash could be put to work for you. Businesses often borrow for the same reasons. You can manage personal finances in a similar manor. The risk is getting spread too thin… or worse, not investing the money to make it WORK for YOU!

What works for me may not work for you. Moreover, what works for me today may not work for me in the future. It depends on the situation and the individual plans. A good plan, the willingness to stick to it, and time will get people to their realistic goals – along with living within their means.

I have leased, financed and paid cash... each was the best option for me at that specific time in my life.

:)

Closed-end lease: Less cash flow = Less monthly payments and in general with a shorter, fixed term (commitment) that you can walk away from at the end. The risks may include: early termination penalties, wear and tear, mileage, possible higher insurance, etc…

I have never experienced higher insurance with a lease.

Financing: In general, requires higher cash flow with longer commitment when compared to leasing options. You own the asset at the end of the term.

That "asset" is a consistently depreciating one.......:paranoid:

Pay cash: Up-front payment, own asset.

Generally the cheapest way, as long as you keep the car 8-10 years.....

Leases seem custom tailored to car flippers who need something new every three years, it's perfect for them as long as they don't drive alot of miles (I know you can extend the mileage, just generally speaking).

Plus you don't have to worry about trading it in or selling it, and it's always under warranty.

Sort of like having perpetual car payments that never end, with a different ride every 3 years.

Also leasing can be a way to drive a vehicle you might not have been comfortable with the monthly payments if you had financed it, so you could drive a pricier vehicle than you could have purchased/financed outright. Not saying that applies to all people who lease of course, but I'm sure some of them at least.

Give it a try...........:wave:
Well I do understand the point he was trying to make and he does make some good ones in a roundabout way, but comparing leasing a vehicle to renting a roof over your head is a bit of a stretch, and they should never be compared for many, many reasons...two different ballparks:

1. A place to live is a necessity. In some parts of the US/the world, a vehicle is not.
2. Property tax issues.
3. Maintenance issues: Renting a dwelling - you don't pay for such things. Leasing a vehicle - most times you still do.
4. Many can rent in a desirable area but they can't own in the same area. But with vehicles, a stripped down Kia will essentially accomplish the same function as a loaded Accord: they both get you from point A to point B.

There is much to comment on with this subject, but leasing is not meant for most people and inexperienced folks could easily get taken, period. Also, it is best to compare leasing an auto in the same category; once you step outside of that, the waters get very muddied and it is hard to compare.

ESHBG, excellent post. Thanks for the clear & to-the-point perspective... :cool:

ESHBG, excellent post. Thanks for the clear & to-the-point perspective... :cool:
Thanks, Osiris! :)