I've tried the stock oil which I started out with on the Honda, decided to switch to Pennzoil Platinum 5w, which I like, then tried Mobil 1 Synthetic. Today, I decided to go back to the Platinum because of how thick the Mobil 1 was getting as it neared time to change. The Platinum always stayed light looking.

I wanted to try Amsoil 5w, but the mechanic said it's hard to get and find if I happened to be in another town and needed a change. I'm crossed-eyed from reading up on motor oils, mainly synthetic ones on the internet the past few days, not to mention confused. I just want a good synthetic oil that will give the engine the best performance and durability, that's all. The Platinum is about ten dollars cheaper than the Mobil 1, and I really couldn't tell any difference between the two oils.

Thanks for your opinion.

What does the owner's manual say as far as viscosity goes, is it 0w20 or 5w20?

Stick with an oil that is approved by either Honda or Ford if it's 5w20, the ones that are approved are tested at a double time temperature test.

Mobil 1 makes oils that meet this and so does Motorcraft, either in semi-synthetic or full. Amsoil doesn't period. They make claims that all their oils meet whatever standards and tests they say they do, but they submit none for actual testing by automakers.

I've been happy with the Motorcraft 5w20 semi syn. I pay $16.25 for a 5 quart container when I do a change.

Understand that none of the semi or full synthetic 0w or 5w20 oils are for extended drain intervals. I'd never go over 7500 miles with any of them. They are all NOT ACEA rated for extended drain. Even Mobil 1's e.p. oils in 5w20 are not rated by ACEA for extended drain.

If you've used Pennzoil plat, it's pretty much the same stuff as Shell's synthetic and Quaker State synthetic as they're all made by the same company.

Moved to Fluid Dynamics

5w according to the manual. I've done good with the Platinum, but the Mobil 1 got thickened toward change time. Not good. Pennzoil never did that. I always have it changed every 3 months regardless, so drain time is no issue.

Thanks-

The oil that's best is the one that's changed on a timely basis. There is no answer to your question. Which car is best, which ice cream is best, which state is best, which planet is best? The list can go on ad nauseum. Go to bobistheoilguy and read to learn. By the way.........which senior diapers are best? Read and learn then make your own decision.

the oil that's best is the one that's changed on a timely basis. There is no answer to your question. Which car is best, which ice cream is best, which state is best, which planet is best? The list can go on ad nauseum. Go to bobistheoilguy and read to learn. By the way.........which senior diapers are best? Read and learn then make your own decision.
lol
++

I have used these 3 full synthetic for my last 3 oil changes

Castrol Syntec
Pennzoil Plantium
Mobil 1-current

Seat of the pants feel I like Castrol Syntec the most. My car has been feeling weak lately with M1. PP is neck and neck behind the Syntec.

Which synthetic is best? The one I can get the lowest sale price on.... lately, that's been Pennzoil. Next month, it'll be Mobil 1

http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/showthread.php?t=27559

5w according to the manual. I've done good with the Platinum, but the Mobil 1 got thickened toward change time. Not good. Pennzoil never did that. I always have it changed every 3 months regardless, so drain time is no issue.

Were you changing/checking the M1 on a cold engine? That may explain why it seemed thicker esp if this happened during the winter mos. If the M1 was darker that could mean it was doing its job and cleaning carbon deposits etc. Maybe all the particulate in the oil made it seem a little thicker.

The only way to tell which oil is better is to have some uoa's done and compare the results. You would ideally want the same brand oil in the engine for 2-3 intervals to get accurate results.

If your changing your oil every 3mos and less than 5k miles your wear results will probably be just as good using the MC syn-blend 5w20 with a nice price savings.

I've been happy with the Motorcraft 5w20 semi syn. I pay $16.25 for a 5 quart container when I do a change.

Hi Fred,

Are you getting your oil at Walmart? Around here the MC is $12 and change after the price increases. With all the cars in your fleet that may add up a little bit. Esp since some of those cars rack up the miles pretty quick except for the 03 sedan. :D

lol
++

What was so funny about that? It didn't pertain to the subject of the thread.

I'm with Pennzoil Platinum, know it's good and have no regrets. I gather all oil is the same, all cars, all everything. Wrong, but I guess that's the answer to my question.

Around here the MC is $12 and change after the price increases.

It's about $12 at walmart here as well, but the parts chains usually have it for $3-4 more. I made the switch to MC about a year ago after seeing good reviews + the cheap price.

I know myself and the old DSMers were crazy about Amsoil and Mobil 1....

Back in the day I remember Amsoil > Mobil 1 based on my reading. Amsoil oils were lasting 1.5x as long as Mobil 1 while still maintaining its properties.

If you're doing oil changes at 3k then I agree, the oil is going to make very little difference - obviously just stick to a "top 3 brand".

IMO, top 3 are:
Amsoil, Mobil 1, Pennzoil

Until we start driving a 400hp car, haul huge loads, or go 10k without oil changes... its not really a big deal. We're not pushing the limits of the oil by any means... the viscosity will barely increase, if any at all.

In regards to your Mobil 1 being darker than the others - was there less light shining on the Mobil 1? did you drive with more of a load? maybe its cleaning the crap that the other oils didn't? Maybe the dude doing the oil change didn't drain all the oil properly before the Mobil 1? Who knows, but I wouldn't worry about it.

when I called the honda dealership to get pricing for an oil change, he said they don't recommend using synthetics because then you must "always stick to synthetic". I thought this was just a myth?

also doing an oil change myself is not in the question. I don't want to deal with lifting the car and cleaning up and disposing the oils.

SUPPOSEDLY....

Conventional motor oil has more "clotting" properties than synthetic. So on older cars its not a good idea to go from conventional to synthetic.... as synthetic will make your oil leaks worse. Therefore, on new cars it doesn't matter (myth)

There is no proof to that statement. If my memory serves correct, that's what I read a while back.

when I called the honda dealership to get pricing for an oil change, he said they don't recommend using synthetics because then you must "always stick to synthetic". I thought this was just a myth?

also doing an oil change myself is not in the question. I don't want to deal with lifting the car and cleaning up and disposing the oils.


Bless their ignorant hearts. You can switch back and forth as you see fit but there is no advantage in doing so.

Hi Fred,

Are you getting your oil at Walmart? Around here the MC is $12 and change after the price increases. With all the cars in your fleet that may add up a little bit. Esp since some of those cars rack up the miles pretty quick except for the 03 sedan. :D

I get the oil from a local Ford dealer that the shop I work for gets parts from.
I'm lazy, I'm not going to drive to get it, if it can be brought to me. :)

I know myself and the old DSMers were crazy about Amsoil and Mobil 1....

Back in the day I remember Amsoil > Mobil 1 based on my reading. Amsoil oils were lasting 1.5x as long as Mobil 1 while still maintaining its properties.

If you're doing oil changes at 3k then I agree, the oil is going to make very little difference - obviously just stick to a "top 3 brand".

IMO, top 3 are:
Amsoil, Mobil 1, Pennzoil

Until we start driving a 400hp car, haul huge loads, or go 10k without oil changes... its not really a big deal. We're not pushing the limits of the oil by any means... the viscosity will barely increase, if any at all.

In regards to your Mobil 1 being darker than the others - was there less light shining on the Mobil 1? did you drive with more of a load? maybe its cleaning the crap that the other oils didn't? Maybe the dude doing the oil change didn't drain all the oil properly before the Mobil 1? Who knows, but I wouldn't worry about it.

It's possible this guy may have not drained it right. I had to U-turn and drive it right back in to get him to put a sticker on the windshield! I'm not going back there, but returning to Honda for all my stuff. But even they aren't all there. I got a reminder card that 20kmile stuff was due, so I took it in. All I got was "Does it need an oil change?" Of course, it didn't, but she told me when it needs the next oil change, they would do the other. So, if I'm low on power steering fluid or window wash, I guess I can just lump it. I don't think they've ever checked the surpentine belt or hoses, but then it's not that high mileage....yet.

I like the Pennzoil pretty good. I can tell slight differences in my performance with different things on a car--sensitive "gas foot" I guess, and I already seem to have better perf. with the Platinum. I'll just stick to what I like.
On the Mobil 1, I looked at it right after the other guy put it in, and it was very light and thin, so I don't know what happened there.

Thanks-

What was so funny about that? It didn't pertain to the subject of the thread.

I'm with Pennzoil Platinum, know it's good and have no regrets. I gather all oil is the same, all cars, all everything. Wrong, but I guess that's the answer to my question.

It DID pertain to the thread. You want to know the best based on opinions? Do some research and form your own opinion. You asked a question that can't possibly be answered and I was trying to show you how ridiculous your question was.

You know what the best is????? The one that you purchase....just stick with a name brand oil and you will be fine.....

There is no "best oil". What oil works best for you will depend on how often you want to change your oil and your driving style. Beyond that, it's really just personal preference.

I use conventional oil. I'm not against using synthetic (I actually have a few cases in my garage that I got on sale), but I find that conventional oil is fine for my use. In fact, I wait until there are sales and stock up on oil. For the price I pay for conventional oil, I'd have to get 3-5 times more usage out of synthetic to break even.

I put nothing but conventional oil in my previous car, and when I sold it at 166k miles, the engine was still running great. Never had to add any oil between oil changes and if there was any oil consumption, it was not noticeable.

With my Accord, I use 5W-20 conventional and follow the Maintenance Minder. So far, I've had two oil changes done... roughly 5k miles each time.

With our Pilot, I use conventional oil and follow the "normal" maintenance schedule (7500 mi OCIs). I've had two UOAs done (by Blackstone) and the results were excellent both times.

http://driveaccord.net/forums/images/buttons/report.gif For YOU, RTexas, and no question is ridiculous. What's STUPID is going around telling others NOT to ask them. What is ignorant is going around ignorant, and NOT asking questions. Sorry about your temper problem. Gotta see that shrink soon.

I think the Honda likes the Platinum better, as the pep is better, so that's what we're sticking with. It seems to have back some pep it had lost on the Mobil 1.

(Now to get the bad smell outta my nose from Mr. Congeniality up there [RTexas])

Oh and I'll ask any d*** question on here, RTexas, that I please whether it suits you or not, pal.

Sorry for the problem, SJLee. It was taken care of.

That's good about the conventional oil. I've read pros and cons on either, but just decided on the synthetic. Hondas are built to last, so maybe mine will do that.

Thanks to all, esp. those with common courtesy. It helps and won't hurt.

http://driveaccord.net/forums/images/buttons/report.gif For YOU, RTexas, and no question is ridiculous. What's STUPID is going around telling others NOT to ask them. What is ignorant is going around ignorant, and NOT asking questions. Sorry about your temper problem. Gotta see that shrink soon.

I think the Honda likes the Platinum better, as the pep is better, so that's what we're sticking with. It seems to have back some pep it had lost on the Mobil 1.

(Now to get the bad smell outta my nose from Mr. Congeniality up there [RTexas])

Oh and I'll ask any d*** question on here, RTexas, that I please whether it suits you or not, pal.

:paranoid::dunno:

You asked a question, perhaps not the most intelligent question as you may have noted from the answers most others provided, RTF gave some analogiees to make his point, and suggested for you to do some research, such as http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/ that he mentioned.

RTF did not tell you not to ask questions.

Me think you are over-reacting.

And I highly doubt you, or anyone, can actually tell "the pep is better" with the seat of your pants using one good motor oil versus another, unless one is 90 weight gear oil and the other is a 0 weight light lubricant AND you are in a sub-zero environment, the "pep" gain it's likely all in your head I'm afraid............... :paranoid:

The pep is better.....You got to be kidding right....

Sorry for the problem, SJLee. It was taken care of.

That's good about the conventional oil. I've read pros and cons on either, but just decided on the synthetic. Hondas are built to last, so maybe mine will do that.

Thanks to all, esp. those with common courtesy. It helps and won't hurt.

I think the only "pro" for conventional is cost. In all other areas, I believe that synthetic is superior. IMO, if you're not doing extended OCIs or racing, conventional oil will do just as well.

http://driveaccord.net/forums/images/buttons/report.gif For YOU, RTexas, and no question is ridiculous. What's STUPID is going around telling others NOT to ask them. What is ignorant is going around ignorant, and NOT asking questions. Sorry about your temper problem. Gotta see that shrink soon.

I think the Honda likes the Platinum better, as the pep is better, so that's what we're sticking with. It seems to have back some pep it had lost on the Mobil 1.

(Now to get the bad smell outta my nose from Mr. Congeniality up there [RTexas])

Oh and I'll ask any d*** question on here, RTexas, that I please whether it suits you or not, pal.

Didn't take you long to show your true colors did it? The fact that you can sense "pep" with Penz Plat in your car is icing on your flaming cake. Asking intelligent questions is the key point, one that you obviously can not grasp. I rest my case.

Case closed....

Disappointed in all these flaming attacks.

Also in the strong personal opinions uninformed by evidence.

Oil standards are set by the manufacturers to ensure that oils, SM being the current standard, provide the proper lubrication, acid fighting performance et al. There are many good oils, "dino" and synthetic, that do well. RTexasF is absolutely right when he pointed you to look at the UOAs on Bobistheoilguy.

I would wonder how you can feel a difference in engine performance from one 5w20 oil to another. I have never been able to feel one, been driving for 35 years, Hondas for 16.

An earlier poster threw off an opinion that you should never take oil changes past 7500 miles. He offered no empirical evidence to support his opinion. I have UOAs from my 03 Accord showing that we can go 8500+ miles quite safely with some oils.

I have also done well with Pennzoil Platinum in our Accords. The best result I have had (based on UOA) is with Renewable Lubricants Bio-Syn 5w20, which I recommend with enthusiasm. But as said, there are many oils that will do just fine.

Fred hit the nail on the head. The Motorcraft oil is fantastic and cheap! I run it in my Ranger. One year or 10k miles. And seeing that I don't drive the MZ3 as much as I use to. I will be switching it to the MC 5w-20 oil. The HCHII will spend its life on M1 0w-20 at 10k mile oci. The Accord spent its life on M1 0w/5w-20 depending on the season. I should have just ran the MC in it and saved a few bucks.

My own belief is run a good air filter and a good oil filter and the oil will take care of it's self over all. Even the cheapest of oils seem to be better than the best oils of 20 years ago. Syn excluded of course.

I do my own oil changes for about $35 using M1 & M1 Filter. In my case synthetic oil increases my MPG about 1.5 mpg to 2 = 25 to 35 miles per tank of gas. The extra cost for synthetic pays for itself 2 times over in the end. I think more people should factor this in when calculating cost of synth vs conv. oil. Even if paying someone to do the oil change you come out ahead.

05Honda: I went back and re-read your initial post to be sure I'd focus on your priorities. If I understand you correctly, you've tried two synthetic oils, Pennzoil Platinium ("PP") and Mobil 1 ("M1"), and you've considered using Amsoil but decided again it because it's not particularly easy to find. You also were put off by the fact that M1 appeared (to you) to thicken over time. You liked PP, on the other hand, because it didn't discolor.

You didn't say whether you change your own oil, but I have the impression you don't. And I also have the impression you want to minimize the number of oil changes you have to pay for.

Based on your priorities, PP is best for you. But, as this thread should make clear, if you change one or more of your priorities, the "best oil" will also change. For example, Castrol's "Edge" is an excellent synthetic oil, but it's expensive and in the United States it's only available in two weights, 5w-30 and 10w-30. I wouldn't hesitate to use it because I know it will provide additional protection against premature camshaft wear, but you said you wanted a 5w-20. Similarly, M1's Extended Performance claims it will provide protection for 15,000 miles. It almost certainly would discolor over time, which concerns you, but its use would allow you to minimize your oil changes. However, any of these three (or Valvoline's synthetic, "Synpower" -- which will soon offer a 300k mile engine warranty) are outstanding products and each will meet all of Honda's maintenance requirements.

Doing a used oil analysis (UOA) will help you get a fact-based understanding of what's happening with the engine. Terry Dyson (www.dysonanalysis.com) is excellent and very knowledgeable about Hondas. Fuel dilution is a common issue with Honda engines, something to be aware of.

What does the owner's manual say as far as viscosity goes, is it 0w20 or 5w20?

Stick with an oil that is approved by either Honda or Ford if it's 5w20, the ones that are approved are tested at a double time temperature test.



dont get me wrong i love honda, but, saying use whever they recomend sometimes cant be taken seriously, only reason honda or others use 5W-20 is to elevate their fuel economy raitings to government. its "thinner" then 5W-30 therefore engine doesn waste just a little effort to work in that oil therefore little better fuel economy, in long run 5W20 is not as good for engine as 5W-30


i use amsoil and their filter and change every 5k
Mobil is like microsoft, they are huge company and do whatever they want

dont get me wrong i love honda, but, saying use whever they recomend sometimes cant be taken seriously, only reason honda or others use 5W-20 is to elevate their fuel economy raitings to government. its "thinner" then 5W-30 therefore engine doesn waste just a little effort to work in that oil therefore little better fuel economy, in long run 5W20 is not as good for engine as 5W-30


There's no proof that using 5W-20 oil will shorten the life of your engine compared to using 5W-30. In fact, most 5W-30 oils will shear down to 5W-20, while 5W-20 oils keep their viscosity.

Many people have done used oil analysis on 5W-20 (including myself) and found that the wear isn't any different than using 5W-30.

I asked this question to my mechanic.................certified by Honda. He has done hundreds of oil changes...........in his opinion, just follow the manufacturers guidelines when it comes to the oil and change intervals. He said OEM 5w-20 changed every 3K-5K miles if fine. He services an Acura NSX that a doctor owns...............the Dr. keeps up with all his maintenance and changes his oil with OEM every 3k-5k miles..........this NSX has almost 250K miles on it without a single engine problem. I think Im going with what my mechanic recommends.

There's no proof that using 5W-20 oil will shorten the life of your engine compared to using 5W-30. In fact, most 5W-30 oils will shear down to 5W-20, while 5W-20 oils keep their viscosity.

Many people have done used oil analysis on 5W-20 (including myself) and found that the wear isn't any different than using 5W-30.
You are correct, sir, there is no "proof" that 5W-20 oil will "shorten engine life," but there is a growing body of evidence on various websites -- (see, e.g., honda-tech.com; ephatch.com; search "camshaft galling") -- which would cause a reasonable person to question whether 5W-20 conventional oil provides adequate protection against shear and camshaft pitting/galling in high-mileage k20 engines.

On the other hand, we know that Honda still recommends the use of 5W-30 weight oil in all its higher performance engines (and 10W-30 in the case of the S2000) and, further, that Honda recommends 5W-30 weight synthetic oil (Mobil 1) in its turbocharged engines. Consequently, it's reasonable to conclude that 5W-30 weight oil provides more protection against extremes of heat and shear than 5W-20 weight oil in a k20 engine.

You are correct, sir, there is no "proof" that 5W-20 oil will "shorten engine life," but there is a growing body of evidence on various websites -- (see, e.g., honda-tech.com; ephatch.com; search "camshaft galling") -- which would cause a reasonable person to question whether 5W-20 conventional oil provides adequate protection against shear and camshaft pitting/galling in high-mileage k20 engines.

On the other hand, we know that Honda still recommends the use of 5W-30 weight oil in all its higher performance engines (and 10W-30 in the case of the S2000) and, further, that Honda recommends 5W-30 weight synthetic oil (Mobil 1) in its turbocharged engines. Consequently, it's reasonable to conclude that 5W-30 weight oil provides more protection against extremes of heat and shear than 5W-20 weight oil in a k20 engine.

Have you seen anything on these websites that show a similar result with the J30 engine?

my mechanic said that 5w-30 is better for the engine than 5w-20, so thats why I use 5w-30. but i dont think it makes a big difference.

Fred hit the nail on the head. The Motorcraft oil is fantastic and cheap! I run it in my Ranger. One year or 10k miles. And seeing that I don't drive the MZ3 as much as I use to. I will be switching it to the MC 5w-20 oil. The HCHII will spend its life on M1 0w-20 at 10k mile oci. The Accord spent its life on M1 0w/5w-20 depending on the season. I should have just ran the MC in it and saved a few bucks.

My own belief is run a good air filter and a good oil filter and the oil will take care of it's self over all. Even the cheapest of oils seem to be better than the best oils of 20 years ago. Syn excluded of course.

MC is great in Hondas and its not some fad that oh Honda guys like putting oil with a Ford label in their cars for some odd reason, MC really runs great in Hondas. In my V6, it was night and day how the car ran with MC and any other oil. However recently, Valvoline Max life came into the picture(my local market) and I tried it and am smitten. I get the same great mileage but I like to think I get better protection since this oil is purported to have GRP IV oil in it!(10-20%) Anywho, I would not be averse to trying M1 0w-20 either as it has also been purported to contain GRP IV due to better ingredients. Better ingredients, Better Oil 5w/0w 20!

Mobil is like microsoft, they are huge company and do whatever they want

Because a company is huge does not mean they are evil or "do whatever they want."

Does GM "want" to go into bankruptcy and have shareholder value wiped out? It was the largest corporation in the world for many years.


Becuase Amsoil is small does not make them a Saint or Luke Skywalker fighting the Evil Empire. :lmao:

Buying products from a multi-level markerter is annoying though.

Why can't I just walk into an auto parts store or racing shop and buy Amsoil?

Amway Herbal Life Amsoil good grief it is annnoying.

The Advance Auto Parts Stores here are running a special - 5 qts Mobil 1 plus a Mobil 1 filter for $29.99 - about $18 off list.

Be sure to buy the Advanced Fuel Economy version (fluorescent green cap, 0W-XX weights) and get the $10 MIR rebate form here

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Promotions/Promotions.aspx

after taking a lame-o fuel economy challenge (save up to $231 in fuel costs annually by DRIVING LESS).

In my V6, it was night and day how the car ran with MC and any other oil.

How exactly was it night and day? I switched to MC a few oil changes ago, but other than possibly a slight improvement in mpg's I see no diff at all from when I was using Castrol dino.

How exactly was it night and day? I switched to MC a few oil changes ago, but other than possibly a slight improvement in mpg's I see no diff at all from when I was using Castrol dino.

I didn't notice any difference either after I switched to MC 5w20 from the dealer's dino. I did get a uoa done after 4800 miles with excellent results. The iron reading was a 3 while the univ. avg is a 7.

Like you said there was a slight improvement in mpg. The only other thing I noticed is when checking the oil level with the MC the residual oil on the paper towel seemed to soak in and spread thru a small area of the paper towel at a much faster rate than the dealer dino. The dino oil just seemed to sit on the paper towel versus the MC. Just thought that was kind of interesting.

The oil that's best is the one that's changed on a timely basis. There is no answer to your question. Which car is best, which ice cream is best, which state is best, which planet is best? The list can go on ad nauseum. Go to bobistheoilguy and read to learn. By the way.........which senior diapers are best? Read and learn then make your own decision.

California, not Texas, hahahaha...

Currently, I'm going out to 7500-8000 on Valvoline or Castrol synthetic oil (5W-20), and an AmsOil 25K filter (I go to, 3 x 8K = 24K miles). I have purchased an oil analysis kit, to test my oil. Well see what it shows (I'll post the results hear). On my Honda (2001) the recommendation is out to 7500 miles, and a new filter every other time. My WAG is I'm OK...

The kind the go's in your engine.

I just bought an '03 Accord, 4cyl. Haven't decided what I'm gonna use in that yet. My '95 Mazda 626 2.0 4 cyl, I have been using generic dino 15W-40 heavy duty diesel oil since 40K. (now has over 200m) Change out every 5-10K miles. Engine burns no oil and is quiet as a mouse. When people hear my car idle they never believe it's got that many miles. This 5W-20 recommendation seems awful thin to me. I just can't decide if I want to try this in my "new to me" car. My wife's '02 Odyssey I've been using Rotella
5W-40 diesel oil (synthetic) It seems to like that really well. Might just switch the Accord over to that on my next change.

I just bought an '03 Accord, 4cyl. Haven't decided what I'm gonna use in that yet. My '95 Mazda 626 2.0 4 cyl, I have been using generic dino 15W-40 heavy duty diesel oil since 40K. (now has over 200m) Change out every 5-10K miles. Engine burns no oil and is quiet as a mouse. When people hear my car idle they never believe it's got that many miles. This 5W-20 recommendation seems awful thin to me. I just can't decide if I want to try this in my "new to me" car. My wife's '02 Odyssey I've been using Rotella
5W-40 diesel oil (synthetic) It seems to like that really well. Might just switch the Accord over to that on my next change.

I have run multiple vehicles ranging from small I4s to large V8s to over 200k on dino 5W20 in Las Vegas and Phoenix. With the extreme amounts of heat, dust, short trips, extensive idling, and the fact that I am not easy on vehicles I would think that if 5W20 was too thin to provide adequate protection I would have had an issue but every engine has run great when the vehicles were sold. That said, I love the Rotella 5W40 in my diesel truck, I used it in one of my bikes, and many people recommend it for cars on Bob is the oil guy. It's a good oil and I think it would work fine in the new to you Accord.

I don't know how many miles are on the Accord but you might want to also look at some of the high mileage synthetics if you are intent on running synthetic.

Tell it to this guy:
http://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1533130#Post1533130

Tell it to this guy:
http://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1533130#Post1533130

Tell what? From that thread, it appears that the OP had a problem with a camshaft lobe. The rest of the posts are merely people speculating on what might have caused it and some additional OT posts regarding people painting car companies with a broad brush. :dunno:

Tell what? From that thread, it appears that the OP had a problem with a camshaft lobe. The rest of the posts are merely people speculating on what might have caused it and some additional OT posts regarding people painting car companies with a broad brush. :dunno:
My point was only that the OP on Bob's apparently did everything one could reasonably expect of a conscientious owner -- frequent oil changes, use of a quality synthetic oil (actually a top-rated synthetic), quality oil filters, etc. -- and still the 5W-20 weight oil he used failed to prevent camshaft galling. It's not all that uncommon in high-mileage k-series engines.

Was 5W-20 weight oil a source (the source?) of the problem? Who knows? We could debate this endlessly. (Others have.) It could simply have been a bum camshaft; a metallurgical issue. But, based on what the OP wrote, lack of maintenance doesn't seem to be the source, nor does it appear the vehicle's owner abused his car. So that leaves us two potential sources for this camshaft failure, oil or metallurgy.

From where I sit, if poor metallurgy were the source, it's reasonable to believe that more than one camshaft lobe would have been affected. That leaves oil shearing. In this regard, if you do a Google search on "camshaft galling" it will take you several Honda websites that discuss this issue at length. That's not a coincidence.

I don't have a dog in this fight. IMHO, this potential issue can easily be avoided by using a quality 5W-30 weight oil, or even better, an HTO-06 certified synthetic.

My point was only that the OP on Bob's apparently did everything one could reasonably expect of a conscientious owner -- frequent oil changes, use of a quality synthetic oil (actually a top-rated synthetic), quality oil filters, etc. -- and still the 5W-20 weight oil he used failed to prevent camshaft galling. It's not all that uncommon in high-mileage k-series engines.

Was 5W-20 weight oil a source (the source?) of the problem? Who knows? We could debate this endlessly. (Others have.) It could simply have been a bum camshaft; a metallurgical issue. But, based on what the OP wrote, lack of maintenance doesn't seem to be the source, nor does it appear the vehicle's owner abused his car. So that leaves us two potential sources for this camshaft failure, oil or metallurgy.

From where I sit, if poor metallurgy were the source, it's reasonable to believe that more than one camshaft lobe would have been affected. That leaves oil shearing. In this regard, if you do a Google search on "camshaft galling" it will take you several Honda websites that discuss this issue at length. That's not a coincidence.

I don't have a dog in this fight. IMHO, this potential issue can easily be avoided by using a quality 5W-30 weight oil, or even better, an HTO-06 certified synthetic.

If it were an oil issue, then I'd also say that "it's reasonable to believe that more than one camshaft lobe would have been affected" as well.

I would say if this was as widespread of an issue that Honda would start recommending owners to start using 5W-30 oil. It wouldn't be unheard of for an automaker to change their recommendation after problems started to surface (e.g. Toyota and their engine sludge issue).

Peanut Oil

If it were an oil issue, then I'd also say that "it's reasonable to believe that more than one camshaft lobe would have been affected" as well.

I would say if this was as widespread of an issue that Honda would start recommending owners to start using 5W-30 oil. It wouldn't be unheard of for an automaker to change their recommendation after problems started to surface (e.g. Toyota and their engine sludge issue).
Thank you for your response.

With regard to your first point, as I'm sure you know, camshafts are first cast and then the lobes hardened in a separate process. But each process is done in one step. Thus, if there were a metallurgical defect in casting, it's much more likely to affect the entire camshaft than a single lobe.

The same is not true with regard to lubrication. As I'm sure you know, Honda k-series engines use a splash method to lubricate the camshafts. Thus, when oil shearing occurs, the lobes at the far ends of the camshafts (those most distant from the lubrication source) are typically the first to go. It's much the same with rod- and main-bearings. They are not going to fail simultaneously.

With regard to your second point -- the possibility that Honda might have some (any?) incentive to acknowledge this potential issue: 1) Camshaft galling typically occurs, if at all, in high mileage engines, many of which have been abused or neglected. By that time, the engine warranty has run and the car is much more likely to be in the hands of a second or third owner with whom HMC has neither a financial nor a contractual relationship. Thus, Honda has nothing to gain by even acknowledging this issue may exist, and much to lose.

2) And speaking of losses, Honda receives literally millions of dollars in Corporate Average Fuel Economy ("CAFE") incentives each year. Those results an integral part of the company's image, and the use of 5W-20 weight oil is crucial to the company's achieving them. Moreover, the penalty for failing to meet USA CAFE standards recently increased from $5.00 to $5.50 per tenth of a mile per gallon for each tenth under the prescribed federal standard times the total number of vehicles manufactured for a given model year. Thus, (IMHO) Honda would never consider changing its fleet engine-oil recommendation when the benefits to the company are so great and the potential costs to a few hundred car owners are speculative at best.

But, if you happen to be one of those owners, it makes great sense for the individual owner to benefit from Honda's extensive research in this area. This can easily be accomplished through the use a Honda certified HTO-06 synthetic. Or not. Your choice.

Thank you for your response.

With regard to your first point, as I'm sure you know, camshafts are first cast and then the lobes hardened in a separate process. But each process is done in one step. Thus, if there were a metallurgical defect in casting, it's much more likely to affect the entire camshaft than a single lobe.

The same is not true with regard to lubrication. As I'm sure you know, Honda k-series engines use a splash method to lubricate the camshafts. Thus, when oil shearing occurs, the lobes at the far ends of the camshafts (those most distant from the lubrication source) are typically the first to go. It's much the same with rod- and main-bearings. They are not going to fail simultaneously.

With regard to your second point -- the possibility that Honda might have some (any?) incentive to acknowledge this potential issue: 1) Camshaft galling typically occurs, if at all, in high mileage engines, many of which have been abused or neglected. By that time, the engine warranty has run and the car is much more likely to be in the hands of a second or third owner with whom HMC has neither a financial nor a contractual relationship. Thus, Honda has nothing to gain by even acknowledging this issue may exist, and much to lose.

2) And speaking of losses, Honda receives literally millions of dollars in Corporate Average Fuel Economy ("CAFE") incentives each year. Those results an integral part of the company's image, and the use of 5W-20 weight oil is crucial to the company's achieving them. Moreover, the penalty for failing to meet USA CAFE standards recently increased from $5.00 to $5.50 per tenth of a mile per gallon for each tenth under the prescribed federal standard times the total number of vehicles manufactured for a given model year. Thus, (IMHO) Honda would never consider changing its fleet engine-oil recommendation when the benefits to the company are so great and the potential costs to a few hundred car owners are speculative at best.

But, if you happen to be one of those owners, it makes great sense for the individual owner to benefit from Honda's extensive research in this area. This can easily be accomplished through the use a Honda certified HTO-06 synthetic. Or not. Your choice.

Excellent points that you've brought up. I have to say that I am not that familiar with the manufacturing process nor the specific design of the K-series engines, so I have to bow to your knowledge.

Regarding the point about Honda acknowledging the issue, I think they would still have an incentive to keep their reliability reputation. As I indicated earlier, Toyota admitted to a design flaw in their engines causing sludge issues... so they recommended that owners do more frequent oil changes. If the problem is that widespread, then Honda could do something similar (admit a design flaw) and recommend more frequent oil changes... before the shearing would become an issue.

In addition, if the problem is related to the oil, I'd think that it would be more widespread and that we'd hear more about it particularly since Honda started recommending 5W-20 in 2001.

Granted, it could very well be a problem with using 5W-20 oil... I don't have enough personal experience or knowledge to deny that with 100% certainty. If people are uncomfortable using 5W-20, then they should by all means use 5W-30 or a synthetic (like you stated). There are no issues with using 5W-30 if they recommend using 5W-20.

Of the MANY UOA's posted on Bitog concerning the 2.4l this is the only problematic one I have seen. Way too many are over 100K miles using 5W20 or 0W20 to make me even blink at this one case. CAFE or not 20 weight oils are here to stay and have proven themselves without question.

If the single cam lobe wear would have occurred with 5W30 in the engine its whole life would the oil be blamed?

Of the MANY UOA's posted on Bitog concerning the 2.4l this is the only problematic one I have seen. Way too many are over 100K miles using 5W20 or 0W20 to make me even blink at this one case. CAFE or not 20 weight oils are here to stay and have proven themselves without question.

If the single cam lobe wear would have occurred with 5W30 in the engine its whole life would the oil be blamed?
RTexas: I think you are misinterpreting the intent of my comments. I'm a Honda guy. I have several, have owned 14, and expect to own many more. I like the cars, and I respect the engineering.

So my comments above were a sort of "heads up" or "consider this", nothing more. Easily ignored.

Turning to your post, I'm familiar with Bob's, understand the utility of UOAs, and know their limitations. They, for example, can tell you that your engine is showing a slight increase in Fe, but they won't tell you to "Pull your valve cover and inspect the camshafts for the source." (Did you note the fellow who experienced a camshaft failure noticed only a slight ticking?)

You obviously have great faith in 5W-20 weight motor oil, and that's fine. I don't. I know that 5W-20 works -- obviously it works -- but the margin of error is vapor thin. Literally.

And I take it you missed my suggestion to do a Google search on "camshaft galling"? If the one post I cited above were the only instance of camshaft galling involving 20 weight oil and k-series engines, I wouldn't have mentioned it at all. It's not. No need to take my word for it.

My only point is that 5W-30 provides more protection. Think of it as wearing a belt and suspenders.

And, WRT yr question "If the single cam lobe wear would have occurred with 5W30 in the engine its whole life would the oil be blamed?" my answer is that I certainly would consider that possibility if there were an increasing history of such failures following a change in the manufacturer's engine-oil specification, as is the case here. But more to your point, I'm not aware of any instance of camshaft galling in a k-series engine when 5W-30 weight oil has been used (and I always ask whenever camshaft galling is reported). In this regard, there is an obvious reason that Honda specifies 5W-30 weight oil in all high performance k-series engines (and 10W-30 in the S2k engines). It's to protect against oil shearing in engines operated in a high temperature, high-rpm environment. So I have to ask: If there is no additional cost involved, why wouldn't you want the additional protection of a quality 5W-30 weight oil?

No misinterpretation, just my opinion. I'm member #409 on Bitog so I have been there a long time.

I think I have a new favorite oil now. Valvoline Synpower. My car is smoother and quieter than with all the other syn oils I've tried ( Castrol Syntec, M1, PP).

Wow, lots of good information in here. Although I will say it is very confusing lol. From what I absorbed here, it is obviously a personal preference. However, if you want a little more protection you should be running 5W-30 syn. oil.

I am coming up on my first oil change for my '09 2.4L 5-MT soon and was researching oils to figure out what to put in it. I push my car pretty hard SOMETIMES. I do not race it, but I love to get it up close to redline when getting on the highway. I also do a lot of short driving since I'm in college and campus is only about 3 miles away. My engine barely gets a chance to warm all the way up before I park it. I plan on keeping this car for a long time, so I want it to last. Any recommendations? I realize a lot of this is opinion based, but based on your experience and my driving habits, what would you suggest using? Thanks in advance for your input!

Credit to d00df00d on Bobistheoilguy:

Looking for an oil recommendation? The BITOG community would love to help you find a good oil for YOUR vehicle and YOUR habits. Sometimes we can also help you find an oil to address a problem you might be having, such as oil consumption. Here's how to make a post that will help us zero in on your best option.

First, remember one thing:

There is no "best" oil!

This question comes up frequently. Everyone has their own personal favorites, but there's no such thing as a one-size-fits-all oil, or a best oil "overall". Every engine is different. Every oil has its place. What works for one engine might not work for another.


So, when you ask for advice, tell us about your car! The more details, the better. Here are the essential points:

1. What kind of vehicle you have
2. What your owner's manual says -- not just viscosity, but certifications (look for acronyms like API SM, ILSAC GF-4, etc.) and change intervals as well
3. Where you live
4. How you drive (easy? hard? fast? slow?)
5. What your daily drive is like (short trips? long trips? city? highway?)
6. Whether your car has any known problems

If you have any preferences -- synthetic vs. conventional, store-bought vs. ordered online, how long you'd like to go between oil changes, etc. -- or any other info you think might be important, let us know that as well.

Once again, the more details, the better. BITOG loves a good oil recommendation thread, especially when you give us a lot to work with.

Welcome to BITOG. See you in the forum!


The point of posting this is simple.......there are a number of factors in choosing an oil including mechanics so far out of date (1960's brainset) that tell you to change every 3k miles. Idiots like that perpetuate the myth. I'll bet no one here knew that many cars in the 1950's used straight 20 oil (but it had to be changed every 1000 miles).

I maintain 3 vehicles. I have been using these products for years with out issues.
2007 Accord EX-L V6 63k miles
1993 Acura Integra 4 cyl. V Tec 170k miles
1993 Chevy Silverado C1500 5.7L 220k miles

I buy my oil filters at O'Reillys. I buy the fleet oil filter made by Wix. You have to buy them by the dozen. A dozen filters in my area is $32.40 plus tax. Less than 3 bucks each.

Accord V6 oil filter is a Pro Tec 164MP

I used Fram oil filters for years before finding the Wix fleet.

I buy Walmart oil. Their brand is Super Tech. Meets all OEM specs. A 5 quart jug is $12.00 in my area.

I used Valvoline for years.

I change the oil and filter every 3k miles.
You can also do a change every 200 gallons of fuel. This method is used for commercial fleets.

I sold a Chevy pick up that was switched from Fram and Valvoline to the Wix oil filter and Super Tech oil. When I sold it it had 320k miles on it. Ran great, but rusted bad.

You make the call. Oil and filter change for $15.00.