The 5MT in my old Accord is having this intermittent problem:

I come to a stop at a light or stop sign, and put the transmission into neutral. When it's time to go again, I push down on the clutch pedal, and try to put the shifter to 1st gear, but the shifter either won't move into 1st, or will only partially move into 1st.

If the shifter sort of goes into 1st, and I lift up the clutch pedal, the transmission makes an awful grinding noise. I can avoid this by putting the shifter back into neutral, letting go of the clutch pedal, and trying again. Pushing the clutch pedal down again always allows the shifter to go into 1st gear. Alternatively, if I release the brake and let the car roll forward even a tiny bit the shifter will be able to get into 1st gear.

Any idea what is wrong? This seems to happen once a month or so. Thanks in advance...

Atomiclightbulb:

You don't indicate what year your car is. Or how many miles. Or what kind of lubricant you have in the gearbox. Or how often it has been changed. Or anything else.

But going by NOTHING other than what sparse information you provide....I'd say your first-gear synchro unit and/or mainshaft/countershaft bearings is/are TOAST.

5G Accord LX, 179,000 miles. No idea what's in the gearbox. Fluids changed at the stealership according to the driver's manual.

Atomiclightbulb:

Start checking your local salvage yards for a (preferably low-mileage) used tranny. Should run you in the $250-$350 range. Fifth-Gen (1994-1997) NEW manual trannies will set your checkbook on fire. Having your own tranny rebuilt will also cost a gazillion megabucks. I'm guessing $1,500-$2,000+ for parts and labor, on a rebuild.

I am pretty sure all you need is a new master clutch cyl. Its not making pressure since the seals are worn. pushing down the second time helps lube the seal up so it generates pressure. Id guess 100-200 bucks.

The synchronizer should only be working while the car is moving. Thus I do not suspect this to be your problem.

Atomiclightbulb:

Sheesh. Need to remind myself that later-Gen cars have a hydraulic clutch setup. Wish Honda had stuck with the (Bowden) cable setup on my trusty '86. It NEVER gives me any problems! (In fact, both my '86 and '02 use only cable actuation for throttle, cruise, and clutch. No hydraulic or fly-by-wire controls, Thank God! Cables are simple, cheap, and they WORK just fine! :D)

While that may not be your issue, as Ipaudio2 astutely points out, you definitely should have your clutch master and slave cylinder checked. :yes:

so did you ever get this diagnosed / fixed? Curious what it was?

so did you ever get this diagnosed / fixed? Curious what it was?

The problem hasn't occurred in the past few weeks and I kind of forgot about it. Next time I take it to the shop I'll ask the mechanics to have a look.

Thanks for the additional insights as well!

I have had this problem on my 1996 Accord EX ever since the car was new. New slave cylinder made no difference. Your transmission is fine. You just have to live with it. Car has 183000 miles and transmission still works fine.

To All:

You are likely using Honda Manual Transmission Fluid (or some equivalent). And that's perfectly fine, except that there ARE far superior alternatives.

May I suggest a switch to either Red Line or AmsOil? They are both fully-synthetic, and GL-4 (GL-5) rated oils. They absolutely work better than any conventional petroleum product.

I've used AmsOil 10W-40 in the gearbox of my trusty '86 some 15 (fifteen) years now. Changing it from Castrol 10W-40, the difference was instantaneous and dramatic. First gear engagement is positive, everytime. And the occasional third gear notchiness/clunk, which is typical of many Honda manual trannies, went completely away. :)

My tranny literally shifts like the proverbial hot knife going through butter, everytime. Regardless of temperature. :yes:

As was pointed out before, when the car isn't moving, it isn't a synchro issue. If it grinds when you downshift into first, even before you let the clutch out, you probably have a synchro issue, however if it just won't go into first at a stand still (no grinding (as long as you hold the clutch in), just can't get it into place) then the synchro isn't your problem. My transmission does this as well (I also have a problem with the synchro, but that is a different issue), and I've found that if you push it as far into first as you can, then ease the clutch out just a bit, while holding pressure on the shifter, it pops right in. Alternately, if you are on a hill, letting the car roll just a bit (like a fraction of an inch) will move the transmission just enough to allow you to shift as well. Changing the trans oil (I've read lots of good things about using Synchromesh in higher mileage transmissions, and am going to give this a try) might help some.

I had similar issues with my 4th gen. It always shifted excellently when moving (except I think the 1st->2nd synchro was getting a bit worn, but it did have 210k) But when I was stopped it was a bit of a pain sometimes to get it into first. Worse when it was cold. I was running Castrol 10W-30 in mine, I don't believe the owners manual back then even mentioned anything like "manual transmission fluid"..it just said to put oil in it.

I can remember when I first got the car it was a bit worse until I got the fluids changed out even though the original owner was always up-to-date on maintenance. I'd suggest a drain and fill with something like those above recommend, it's a really easy job and I believe there's a DIY on here somewhere. I always liked to look at the oil I drained out just to make myself feel good, it was always so clean :D

Atomiclightbulb:

Sheesh. Need to remind myself that later-Gen cars have a hydraulic clutch setup. Wish Honda had stuck with the (Bowden) cable setup on my trusty '86. It NEVER gives me any problems! (In fact, both my '86 and '02 use only cable actuation for throttle, cruise, and clutch. No hydraulic or fly-by-wire controls, Thank God! Cables are simple, cheap, and they WORK just fine! :D)

While that may not be your issue, as Ipaudio2 astutely points out, you definitely should have your clutch master and slave cylinder checked. :yes:

On that note as well I never understood why they changed to the hydraulic clutch. More expensive and a pain imo. I don't mind the DBW as much at least they do use it to computer control the butterfly valve, etc for emissions or whatever. May be unnecessary but it does serve a tiny bit of additional function. Having had both cable and hydraulic clutches I can't imagine any purpose a hydraulic serves over a cable. I'm not positive but IIRC the bore/stroke of the master/slave cylinders are the same (at least on the 90 Acura Legend I had to completely redo most of the clutch hydraulics) so you aren't even getting any advantage from the fluid system....besides even if you were there's plenty of simpler and more reliable ways to create mechanical advantage with a cable....like a LEVER

As I said above, I was also having problems with my trans, sometimes not wanting to go into 1st, or Reverse at a stop, and was unable to downshift into 1st at any speed above 20 without grinding gears. Often it would grind downshifting to 1st at speeds well below 20, and this seemed to happen a LOT until the transmission had some time to warm up.

I had to change the Passengers side drive axle yesterday, and since I had no idea how old the transmission oil was (I just got the car in March) I decided that would be a good time to change the oil as well. I drained out the old oil (which looked to be in very good condition, nice and clean), and after replacing the drive axle, I refilled the trans with Synchro Mesh fluid. The difference is quite noticeable. The shifting still feels a bit notchy, but it hasn't refused to shift into 1st, or reverse at all since the fluid change, AND I can downshift into 1st when ever I want, no grinding, and I've hit 1st at 25 MPH with ho problems. That would have ground the gears for sure before the oil change.

I would say that changing to Synchro Mesh fluid is absolutely with the time and money. It isn't a terribly hard job, doesn't cost a fortune, and it has made a significant difference for me.

My transmission was fine until yesterday :(

(1) The transmission suddenly became more reluctant to shift into 1st gear when I am at a stop. I have to push to get it to go into 1st from neutral.

(2) Now reverse is affected. When I am at a stop, I really have to pull the shifter to get it to go into reverse.

(3) Clutch uptake is a lot shallower than it used to be. If I am at a stop, and I get the car into 1st gear, and then let up on the clutch pedal even a little bit, the clutch will immediately start to bite and if I don't start giving gas, the car will stall. Just 2 days ago, I could let up on the clutch pedal perhaps 2-3 inches more before the clutch started to engage.

I will check the fluids in the morning, but any thoughts? Thanks in advance.

Edit: I have no problems when the car is moving. There are no grinding noises anytime right now.

This happens occasionally on my Prelude. If it doesn't slide into 1st on the first try, don't force it. Let the clutch out completly, let the gear lever go back into neutral, then push the clutch down all the way again and it will slide right into 1st.

Don't worry about it, and don't go spending money trying to fix it.

I checked the transmission fluid reservoir and it was running below the min line, so I added some DOT3 fluid and the clutch pedal now feels much better.

The clutch uptake is still a bit off though, because it feels like the clutch is engaging a bit sooner than it used to.

It's been a few weeks since I swapped over to the Synchromesh fluid, and I'll never change back to regular oil. I still occasionally have difficulty getting into first or reverse from a stop, but letting up on the clutch just a tiny bit while holding the shift lever lets it slip right in.

As for shifting through the gears, it is a lot smoother than it was before, and I can downshift to 1st gear at any speed I want (of course within reason, don't want to over rev the engine) with no worry of grinding the gears.

atomiclightbulb, if your clutch fluid was significantly low, you might want to bleed the slave cylinder, as there could be air in the system now. Also, keep an eye on the fluid level, and if it continues to drop, you might need to look for leaks.