2003 Accord Brakes

[RealWing]

Sounds like Honda has a significant problem with brakes on the new Accords. My wife's Accord has just turned 15000Km (9300miles) and I just got the car back from the dealer after:
1. Replacing the rear disks for the SECOND time, plus new pads
2. Replacing the front disks and pads for the first time due to warping.
The rear disk are rusting very badly - especially around the outer perimeter of the disks.
The front disks were warped 0.048" and 0.050".
Honda wanted to take photos of the rear disks and I found out a Honda Engineer from Japan (yes Japan) was at the dealer and wanted to look at the brakes on every 2003 Accord on the lot. He said it was for normal purposes - yeh right!!!
The Service Advisor also said that many people were having this problem.
There are MANY reports of brake problems on the NHTSA web site on 2003 Accords and includes Technical bulletins from Honda to collect parts for analysis.
Suggest check your brakes asap and if you feel any vibes when braking, your front rotors are likely warped. Also check the rear brakes.

[feferic]

How serious of a vib? When I slow down, i can feel a slight vibration. I thought that may be normal? Mind you, my previous car was a 90 dodge daytona that was falling apart, so everything seems good to me.

[RealWing]

It didnt feel very bad to me. You could feel a slight shake in the steering wheel when braking and even a little bit of vibes when driving at higher speeds. I was surprised that the rotors were warped so much. 0.050" is a lot of warpage.

[meaccord]

thanks realwing for the heads up... i read almost all of the 180 or so complaints on the NHTS site for the 2003 accord.. wow scary stuff...

when did that guy from japan show up....:rolleyes:

[pshivers]

Just had my front brake pads replaced and rotor resurfaced due to "blueing" and .050" rotor warpage problem at 7,500 miles (2003 Accord LX 4-cyl).

I felt a slight repeated "grab" and "release" when stopping a low speeds while using steady pressure on the brake pedal. From Higher speeds (45 mph or higher) it turned into a very definent shaking vibration the could be felt in the steering wheel as well as the brake pedal.

I had read a "short term use" test magazine article on the 2003 Accord several months ago. One of the few complaints about the 2003 Accord was front brake warpage in just a few thousand miles. (Sorry, I can't remember the magazine name other than it being a "online" article). The dealer turned the rotors and replaced the pads for the magazine people.

[princess]

the fact that a Honda rep was wanting to see it for himself is a good sign! That means Honda plans to do something about it! If they do, you may get reimbursed for your cost on the repair.

[pshivers]

I didn't specifically state it, but the repair was done at no cost to me.

My only concern is the rotors were out by .050" and were turned to correct warpage.

Seems by taking this corective action the dealer also "shaved" a number of serviceble miles off of my rotors by turning them, rather than replacing the bad rotors with new ones.

I may be splitting hairs but I'm curious what others think.

Thoughts?

[meaccord]

make a huge stink ... and settle for no less than new rotors... chk out the National Highway and safety site NHTSA.com.. go under complaints consumers section follow intstructions.. and you will see a lot of consumer complaints about the brakes.. so its a wide spread problem

[RealWing]

The Honda engineer from Japan showed up at the dealer 3-4 weeks ago. As someone else stated - this is a good news that there is a direct interest from Japan (even though the cars are made in Ohio) The bad news is that this got through Honda's pre-production testing .
Just for interest, I checked the NHTSA web site for 2003 Toyota Camry and also found many brake complaints - mostly because the pedal went to the floor!!! There was also a TSB to replace front rotors and pads with redesigned ones to correct a warpage problem. Looks like Toyota is a little faster than Honda!!

[RealWing]

When I got home, I checked the Service Manual and found that the max allowed runout on front rotors was 0.004". As compared the runout on my rotors of 12 times this limit!!!!

I'm going to check the runout on the new rotors periodically to see when it starts to go bad.

[princess]

'03 Accord L4
Item
Measurement
Qualification
Standard or New
Service Limit

Brake disc
Thickness
Front
22.9-23.1 mm (0.90-0.91 in.)
21.0 mm (0.83 in.)

Rear
9.9-10.1 mm (0.39-0.40 in.)
8.0 mm (0.31 in.)

Runout
Front
---
0.10 mm (0.004 in.)

Rear
---
0.10 mm (0.004 in.)

Parallelism
Front and rear
---
0.015 mm (0.0006 in.)

[RealWing]

The part numbers of new parts are:
Front rotors: 45251-S87-A00
Front pads: 45022-SDA-C01
Rear Rotors:42510-SDA-A00
Rear Pads: 43022-SV4-G22

Will watch to see if Honda changes the design and thus p/n's

Does anyone know how Honda changes the p/n when they make a revision to the design? ie is it a complete new p/n or does a digit change in the existing p/n?

[JTM]

Originally posted by RealWing

Does anyone know how Honda changes the p/n when they make a revision to the design? ie is it a complete new p/n or does a digit change in the existing p/n?

Maybe Tim at Hondacuraworld can answer this question. ;)

[RealWing]

I just checked my new front rotors for warpage when installing snow tires. Both front rotors had <0.0005" runout at ~3000 Km. So far so good. There are now ~17,000Km on the vehicle.

As a footnote, I found the wheel nuts badly overtorqued by the dealer. The breakaway torque was 130-140 ft-lbs vs specs of 80ft-lbs. I was not impressed. This was after complaining the last time they had my wheels off and they said they would check the calibration on their Snap-On torque sticks.

[princess]

good thing you caught the over torque, that does cause the rotors to warp!!

Glad it's going well...so far! We'll all keep our fingers crossed!!

:D

[MG Accord]

Originally posted by RealWing
I just checked my new front rotors for warpage when installing snow tires. Both front rotors had <0.0005" runout at ~3000 Km. So far so good. There are now ~17,000Km on the vehicle.

As a footnote, I found the wheel nuts badly overtorqued by the dealer. The breakaway torque was 130-140 ft-lbs vs specs of 80ft-lbs. I was not impressed. This was after complaining the last time they had my wheels off and they said they would check the calibration on their Snap-On torque sticks.

I have an 03 V6 sedan and had the front rotors "lightly" turned. This seems to have cured the vibration...for now anyway. Honda's stance on new rotors was that they were not going to replace the rotors unless they were out of spec. Does this light turning shorten the life??? Maybe-depends on how you drive the car.

Also, my front wheels were torqued to well over 80 ft lbs. Joke-

I had to redo mine at 80 as well. However, I did this right when I got home from the dealer.

[Effen Fish]

I hear a grinding noise when stopping at parking lot speeds on my 03 with 14,000 miles. It sounds like metal-to-metal that you would get on worn-through pads. While stopping from highway speeds, there is no grinding. Anybody else?

[RealWing]

I had the grinding noise as well. It was due to corroded rear rotors. Honda put on new ones.

[CatchMe]

Had my 03 V6 EX coupe back to the dealer twice now for the rotor warpage. First time they refaced the fronts, second time they refaced the rears. Its been 5000 miles now and I am just now starting to feel a very light warpage again.

[uvman]

I have an '03 i4 ex coupe. Having some judder, pulsing problems, wondered if anyone has had any luck on having this fixed for good. I found service bulletin 03-069 but thats the only thing I found.

However, my accord does not fit in the vin range listed in the tsb. Any thoughts?

-Dan

[princess]

Even if your VIN isn't listed, that doesn't mean it's not the problem.

Mine was on the list for the long crank, yet it definately had it.

Find a dealer you like, you don't HAVE to use the one where you bought your car, & have it checked. If I remember the bulletin right, the fix was new brake pads. Should be simple enough.

Good Luck!!:)

[uvman]

yeah, thats what I planned on doing. It is still going in. Question, Can I take the tsb in that I think is relevant or is that not ok? Will they question me and tell me that I am not supposed to have access to it? Or shoudl I just make reference to the tsb number and mention that I think that may apply.


-Dan

[princess]

Just the # should be good enough, they can look it up on their computer if they aren't sure about it. Finding info on the internet is a way of life & they should be used to that by now! I don't know about the legalities of who posts what. This info came from an "official" Honda site for their employees (the stuff I put in). I don't know if there's a rule about the employees sharing it. I share it out of concern for other Honda owners. A lot of it can be obtained through Edwards & other sites. This one is just more family-like!

[uvman]

My Accord went in yesterday morning. The front rotors were a little warped, they refinished them, and all is good now.

[my1staccord]

Thanks to this post I started paying more attention to my breaks. I noticed that there was a vibrating sensation when I was breaking at highway speeds. The dealership turned my rotors for me that was about 3 months ago. Well it started again and so I brought it back once more and this time they replaced the rotors/pads. It seems to me that the new rotors are thicker but I very well could be wrong about that. I also noticed that these rotors have paint on the middle part which is nice because my original pair was always rusted there.

I wonder if Honda is using a different company for the rotors now. I hope this is not a recurring problem that we have to replace rotors every 20,000 miles on our cars!!

[princess]

We haven't found the time yet to have the rotors refinished. I don't put that many miles on it, but it will probably get done withing 2 weeks since we're heading back to Disneyland then.

I do think they have change the newest rotors & hopefully they'l be less likely to warp!

Unfortunately rust is normal! I hate it too. If I thought it would stay put, I'd buy enough "touch up" paint to paint the brake parts to match the car. But chipped paint looks worse than rust......

[pshivers]

I had the warped rotor syndrome on my '03 Acord LX I4 at 7,500 mile. It had a really bad vibration while braking, especially at speeds over 45 mph.

The dealer turned the rotors and replaced the brake pads. I'm at just over 19,000 miles now on the Accord and the brakes are still working pefectly, no vibration at all.

[RealWing]

Can you post the part numbers for the rotors they installed? We can compare and see if it is a revised p/n.

[my1staccord]

part number: 45251-s87-a00

[RealWing]

This is the same p/n for rotors as wehn mine were replaced last July. Thus it does not appear to be an improved rotor.

[Unity1]

I wonder if these issues were addressed or not for the 2004 Accords.

Anyone have any info on that one way or the other?

[princess]

Welcome Unity1, I'll look on Monday to see if there's updated info on the '04's our.:)

[Unity1]

Thanks. :)

BTW... on other forums, I'm able to change the text right under my username.... but on this one I can't. Is it some sort of new-comer thing?

I see you have yours changed.

I ask because "Learner's Permit Holder" is definitely not what I want there. :)

[princess]

It will change on it's own after more posts. I think anyone can change it in the profile area, but maybe not until after several posts. I just did it last week & so I have no idea when it was available....:confused:

[Unity1]

It must be something that, after a certain number of posts, I can change by myself. Other forums I'm on... all of which with the exact same look-and-feel of this one... allow me to change it under the Edit Profile area, as you mentioned.

Oh well..... I guess I'll have to be a post whore for a while! ;)

[princess]

I found only an AT case update for the '04's & it's now in the factory direct area. :)

[psc032802]

from what i've gathered, the honda accord rotors are bad. you can resurface them, but the problem may come back very soon - <10k miles.

i've had this squeeking/squeeling of the rotors since the car was at 15k miles or so. now at 53k. i took the car in for estimates from meineke and midas. the honest guy said pads are good, rotors need resurfacing.

if the honda original rotors are known to have problems, should i get aftermarket rotors? and perhaps aftermarket pads as well?

i was quoted 270 for resurfacing rotors and pads from the honda dealer. 350 from the other places including new rotors, new pads.

i plan on keeping the car for another 2 yrs before i get rid of it and get an suv.

[pshivers]

My Front rotors had warped badly again three years ago at 32,000 miles (3rd time) so I replaced them with a set Rabestos drilled and slotted rotors (Part #STS96711L & #STS96711R $89 each) and New front brake pads Raybestos Quiet Stop PGD914QS $46 set. This has cured all warping problems. The new pads required replacement again 2 years and 20,000 miles later. The rotor were turned lightly as recommended for the new brake pads. This has been a big improvement over the OEM rotors. :thmsup:

[cajun]

Is the warped rotor problem mostly on the 4-disc EX or is this a problem with the rear drum LX/DX/VP as well? It seems like most or all of the brake posts I've seen at this site are from EX owners.

[pshivers]

Mine is an LX with Front Discs and rear drums.