I recently purchased an 04' Accord coupe. I love the car and so far its been treating me great. When I bought the car it had 35,120 miles. I noticed that the oil sticker in the corner of the windshield says that the oil change isnt due until 40,120. Is that right?? With Honda's do you only change them every 5000 miles??? :dunno: I've always changed my oil every 3000 miles on my other vehicles so I was a little curious about this. Its not sythetic oil or anything, its just normal Castrol GTX. Even on my Honda CBR954 motorcycle I do oil changes every 3k. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks all....

I change it at about every 3000 miles, I dont know if they can run an extra 2000 miles on it, I just change it out of habit...

I change every 8k or so with full synthetic.

The maintenance schedule is located here

http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8859

7.5k oci for this engine if you want to let it go that long.

I let mine go that long, but I run synthetic. If you want to run dino, 5k will be fine. 3k is overkill and you are wasting money, oil, and time.

The maintenance schedule is located here

http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8859

7.5k oci for this engine if you want to let it go that long.

I let mine go that long, but I run synthetic. If you want to run dino, 5k will be fine. 3k is overkill and you are wasting money, oil, and time.

^^^ Ditto what Steven said...3K is almost always a waste of money and resources and an old tradition that just is no longer valid or necessary for most people. The new, SM/GF4 rated oils will last significantly longer and protect just as well or better at 6K than the older oils would at 3K. Hundreds and thousands of UOA's have proven this time and time again. You are not protecting your engine any more by changing it at 3K than you are at 5-6K.

BTW, Castrol GTX is a very good dino oil. You should be able to go 5K to 7K with no problems, unless you do a lot of severe driving (high speeds, high temp, stop and go, rough/dirty roads, hauling/towing, etc.) But the only way to know "for sure" is to do a UOA (used oil analysis).

I recently switched over to Mobil1 synthetic. I asked my mechanic about the oil change intervals and he said that while it is true that the dino oils nowadays can last longer (ie they don't break down as fast as the older oils) the main reason to change your oil at 3-4k is because of the dirt that can get into the oil which, in turn, can get into your engine. Sure, regular dino oil will hold up to 5, 6, 7k but do you want to run your engine with dirt in it for that long? He said changing it at 3-4k keeps the oil clean which, to him, is now the bigger concern than oil breaking down. I told him I want to change mine at 5k minimum and he said that is fine and that synthetic can definitely last much longer than that, it's just a matter of getting the dirt particles out of your oil and your engine.

I should add, my mechanic has been servicing my famiy's fleet of vehicles for 20 years. Some people on here may disagree with what he told me but I have complete faith in him.

I recently switched over to Mobil1 synthetic. I asked my mechanic about the oil change intervals and he said that while it is true that the dino oils nowadays can last longer (ie they don't break down as fast as the older oils) the main reason to change your oil at 3-4k is because of the dirt that can get into the oil which, in turn, can get into your engine. Sure, regular dino oil will hold up to 5, 6, 7k but do you want to run your engine with dirt in it for that long? He said changing it at 3-4k keeps the oil clean which, to him, is now the bigger concern than oil breaking down. I told him I want to change mine at 5k minimum and he said that is fine and that synthetic can definitely last much longer than that, it's just a matter of getting the dirt particles out of your oil and your engine.

I should add, my mechanic has been servicing my famiy's fleet of vehicles for 20 years. Some people on here may disagree with what he told me but I have complete faith in him.

It's always good to have a trusted mechanic at your disposal, and I would never suggest that he doesn't know his stuff about mechanics. But the truth is, very few mechanics know much about motor oil. They may know "engines", but all too often they rely on rumors, old wives tales, slick marketing, and anecdotal evidence passed down from person to person and generation to generation when it comes to oil and lubrication.

The oil in most modern engines will remain "clean" from external contaminants unless it has serious issues or very poor air and/or fuel/filtration. If you think about it, this should make sense, as the crankcase is sealed and designed to maintain a certain pressure. The "dirt particles" to which your mechanic refers mostly come as by-products of the combustion product and minute amounts of wear. Today's PCMOs, by design, suspend and carry these contaminants very well. And any halfway decent oil filter will remove anything of consequence beyond that. Heck, many car companies don't even recommend changing the oil filter except on every other oil change (although I always do).

If in doubt, check out the UOA's on BobIsTheOilGuy on cars with very long oci's. The proof really is there...the numbers just simply don't lie and really don't support what your mechanic says.

The bottom line? *Most* (not all) people are throwing money away by changing their oil at 3MO/3K.

Just my $.02.

You should be good for up to 7,500 miles. If you're concerned check the oil after a few thousand miles. I checked my oil after about 5,000 miles and the oil was still very clean looking and still pretty full. After I got my car I had the oil change after 3,000 miles for $30 with coupon. Then I got M1 and now am switching to every 7,500 miles.
Hope we've helped you.

I've heard from multiple reliable sources that typically your oil doesn't need to be changed before 5,000. My maintence minder said I was at 10% when I hit 5k, so I had it changed. I plan to rotate the tires and change the oil every 5k to help make it easier to remember. It's supposedly of no benefit to change the oil earlier than 5k.

I change the oil and filter in my diesel every 5.000 miles, because they do dirty up their oil fairly quickly, but I will only change the oil and filter in the Honda once a year during it's annual checkup..

Once they have been run-in, a petrol engine should run for 50K without needing an oil change with no problems whatsoever, 5K oil changes are pure b******t! good for the oil Co's. but a waste of oil and money for everyone else..

I kept my Jag "S" type 3.8 auto (1965) for 10 years with bi-annual oil and filter changes, and it was still running extremely well when I finally sold it to a friend at 225.000 miles in 1983 ish. :)
.

Ive heard other people say that too James, but I just cant do it. I'm doing oil changes at 5k, its easy to remember, and it happens pretty frequently for me.

I change the oil and filter in my diesel every 5.000 miles, because they do dirty up their oil fairly quickly, but I will only change the oil and filter in the Honda once a year during it's annual checkup..

Once they have been run-in, a petrol engine should run for 50K without needing an oil change with no problems whatsoever, 5K oil changes are pure b******t! good for the oil Co's. but a waste of oil and money for everyone else..

I kept my Jag "S" type 3.8 auto (1965) for 10 years with bi-annual oil and filter changes, and it was still running extremely well when I finally sold it to a friend at 225.000 miles in 1983 ish. :)
.

James, James, James! I'm as much an advocate of extended oil changes as anyone. But 50K? I keep going back to UOA's (used oil analyses). With the right combination of oil, engine, and driving conditions, you can extend your OCI signficantly. But the UOA's tell us that clearly there is a point that the oil needs to be changed...and it ain't at 50K. It's more like 5K-15K in most cases.

We can see at what point such things as fuel dilution, oxidation, TBN (acid-neutralizing capacity), total solids, and viscosity are no longer adequate for your engine. In fact, that's one of the main reasons to even DO a used oil analysis: to see just how far you can *safely* extend your oci. And of course to see if there's anything else going on inside your engine that could be a problem (excessive wear, coolant leaks, etc.)

We can always find anecdotal evidence of people who neglected their oil and got away with it. But for $20, a UOA is a must for those who are interested in safely and properly maintaining their engines for the long haul.

Cheers!

It's really funny that everybody who talks about the 50K intervals actually aren't the ones that run it. There was a guy that was on the Mercedes forum, really worked up a storm about it. How his friend had a Porsche, rebuilt the engine and ran 50K intervals...now it has 250K and still running strong. Asked him, how often do you change the oil in your 2004 ML500? 10K or below... :lmao:

Here's a better idea. My friend ran his Accord with 3/4 of a quart of oil for more than 1000 miles and it's still going at over 200K. Wanna try that too?

It's really funny that everybody who talks about the 50K intervals actually aren't the ones that run it. There was a guy that was on the Mercedes forum, really worked up a storm about it. How his friend had a Porsche, rebuilt the engine and ran 50K intervals...now it has 250K and still running strong. Asked him, how often do you change the oil in your 2004 ML500? 10K or below... :lmao:

Here's a better idea. My friend ran his Accord with 3/4 of a quart of oil for more than 1000 miles and it's still going at over 200K. Wanna try that too?

I guess the only way a person *might* consider it is if it burns a quart every 500 miles, and you're constantly adding new oil, and you change the filter regularly (5-10K). Even then....I just don't think so.

:thumbsdow

Even if the oil burns away, the impurities are unlikely to...so even if you added new oil all the time you'd still end up with pretty crappy oil in the end :)

I didn't recommend 50k periods, I said modern engines should be perfectly capable of doing it.

Prior to all the modern tests, UOA's (I had never heard of that untill I read this Honda site!) etc, when presumably engine oil was nowhere near as good as todays, we ALL ran our cars much, much, further without changing the oils than some manufacturers recommend today. :dunno:

Personaly, (excluding the diesel) I doubt I have ever done less than 15K between oil changes, and often an awfull lot more..

I still think that recommending 5K oil changes on a modern engine is just wasting customers oil and money.. If next years workshop manuals told buyers to change oils at 500 mile intervals, doubtless many people would stick to that as well.. :paranoid:

There are times when it pays to use ones common sense. :) If I genuinely believed certain (makes-models) of petrol engined cars needed their oil changing every 5K miles I simply wouldn't buy one..

Benj, people who run their cars for years and years 50-100K without an oil or filter change are hardly likely to be reading or writing on car related websites, they just don't care enough..
.

Well don't know about you...I know how my oil looks when I drain it, and I know that I wouldn't let that crap run in my engine longer than I do. It's just a simple matter of putting 2 and 2 together. Oil = only source of lubrication and Oil = looks and feels like crap, then only source of lubrication = CRAP. That's not how I run my cars :)

BTW dare you to take a 4/6 cylinder Toyota, run a 15K OCI. Open the valve cover at 100K and tell me you won't faint...
http://www.reaction-image.net/albums/N4TECguy/165_6547.jpg
http://www.reaction-image.net/albums/N4TECguy/165_6545.jpg

If you are in doubt...no, this is not because someone replaced their oil too often...

Prior to all the modern tests, UOA's (I had never heard of that untill I read this Honda site!) etc, when presumably engine oil was nowhere near as good as todays, we ALL ran our cars much, much, further without changing the oils than some manufacturers recommend today. :dunno:
.

Huh? If anything, it's just the opposite, at least on this side of the pond. If you went over 3K, you were insane! And before the 70's, it was 2K, then 1K, then 500 miles. To say we "ALL ran our cars much, much further..." couldn't be further from the truth...no disrespect intended.

You are correct: the oils today SM/GF-4 are much better, which is why manufacturer's are recommending longer OCI's and UOA's are showing that it lasts longer.

Benj, that's clean compared to what my diesels oil looks like after only 100 miles! lol.. :D

Some people here stick strong magnets onto the outside of their oil filters to trap tiny metal particles. I also have a friend that has a clear plastic filter fitted into his big top hose on the cooling system. Just depends on how far you want to go with precautions I guess..

I changed the oil and filter on the Honda when I bought it, next change will be it's annual checkup in May 2007.. :)
.

If you went over 3K, you were insane! And before the 70's, it was 2K, then 1K, then 500 miles. >>>


The owner's manual for my '81 Civic recommended 7500 mile oil change intervals.

Ooops ... EX-L_KABONG... By "All" .. I meant in the UK, dunno what went on in the US.. :) Over there you peeps don't even drive on the right side of the road.. :banana: :lmao: :nuts:

One thing that we always used to do here that's rare now, was to add molyslip to all oils, I still do it, but none of my friends bother anymore.. :dunno:
.

If you went over 3K, you were insane! And before the 70's, it was 2K, then 1K, then 500 miles. >>>


The owner's manual for my '81 Civic recommended 7500 mile oil change intervals.

I don't suggest there weren't exceptions, but the vast majority of automakers recommended 3K I'm pretty sure. Honda's 7500 oci was pretty radical if I recall.

My point wasn't the exact dates and exceptions...it was that people just didn't do that back then. Even in a new millenium, most of the motoring public still stubbornly sticks to the 3K/3MO schedule despite so much scientific evidence and advances that suggest it isn't necessary.

Ooops ... EX-L_KABONG... By "All" .. I meant in the UK, dunno what went on in the US.. :) Over there you peeps don't even drive on the right side of the road.. :banana: :lmao: :nuts:

One thing that we always used to do here that's rare now, was to add molyslip to all oils, I still do it, but none of my friends bother anymore.. :dunno:
.

Many people over here still search for and use oils with high molybdenum content (more so than those who use it as an additive, I think). There doesn't seem to be a consensus on it, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of evidence to suggest that it causes any problems, either. From what I've read, it's a pretty darn good element to have in there. Again, the proof is in the UOA...every combination of engine, driving conditions, driver, environment, road conditions, commute, etc. is unique. The only way to know for sure is to do regular UOA's.

Actually, we DO drive on the "right" side of the road. :thmsup:

With my 2003, I stuck with the 3,000 mile intervals. With my 2006, I'm gravitating towards the longer intervals. I changed the factory fill @ 5,000 miles with dino. @ 10,000 miles, I put in Mobil 1 and am going by the MMS. At almost 17,000 its time for the next oil change. My oil level hasn't dropped at all and the oil on the dip stick is still clear - its not dark or murky at all.

I'm also going to send some of the oil for testing to get an objective take on whether or not there is an inordinate amount of contaminants in the 7,000 mile old oil. Oil analysis can detect:

Fuel dilution of lubrication oil
Dirt contamination in the oil
Antifreeze in the oil
Excessive bearing wear
Misapplication of lubricants

Bob is the oil guy has a good read on oil analysis here:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/whatisoilanalysis.htm

I"m sending my oil here:
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

They'll send a free kit and the analysis cost $20.

Well don't know about you...I know how my oil looks when I drain it, and I know that I wouldn't let that crap run in my engine longer than I do. It's just a simple matter of putting 2 and 2 together. Oil = only source of lubrication and Oil = looks and feels like crap, then only source of lubrication = CRAP. That's not how I run my cars :)

BTW dare you to take a 4/6 cylinder Toyota, run a 15K OCI. Open the valve cover at 100K and tell me you won't faint...
http://www.reaction-image.net/albums/N4TECguy/165_6545.jpg


I definitely agree a little common sense goes a long way. If someone notices their oil looks horrible, they need to change it more often or take the direction necessary to correct whatever may be wrong. Part of this though could simply be the innate design of the engine. Looking at these pics makes me think the engine could be designed better so the oil doesn't cook so easily. My 91 Civic had 170,000 miles on it and the inside of the valve cover still looked new. There was no caking or unruly deposits in there. The woman that had it before me wasn't exactly stellar on keeping up with the maint either. When you consider instances like Toyota's sludge problem or the issue wth Audi's 1.8T being subject to crud build up, engine design has to be contributing to the problem. If someone uses some common sense and pays attention to their oil, I think there are plenty of instances where 5,000 mile + oil change intervals are acceptable and won't cause undue long term damage to an engine.

With my 2003, I stuck with the 3,000 mile intervals. With my 2006, I'm gravitating towards the longer intervals. I changed the factory fill @ 5,000 miles with dino. @ 10,000 miles, I put in Mobil 1 and am going by the MMS. At almost 17,000 its time for the next oil change. My oil level hasn't dropped at all and the oil on the dip stick is still clear - its not dark or murky at all.

I'm also going to send some of the oil for testing to get an objective take on whether or not there is an inordinate amount of contaminants in the 7,000 mile old oil. Oil analysis can detect:

Fuel dilution of lubrication oil
Dirt contamination in the oil
Antifreeze in the oil
Excessive bearing wear
Misapplication of lubricants

Bob is the oil guy has a good read on oil analysis here:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/whatisoilanalysis.htm

I"m sending my oil here:
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

They'll send a free kit and the analysis cost $20.

Yep, BITOG is a constant source of info for me...I'm a regular over there now. And Blackstone is where I send my samples, too...at least so far. I might send some to Terry Dyson after the Accord gets broke in a little more.

BTW, I wouldn't go too much by the color/clarity of the oil. Just because it "looks" black or dirty doesn't mean it's spent. That usually just means it's doing exactly what it's supposed to do: cleaning (detergents you know) and suspending, and removing the particles and combustion by-products.

Good luck with your samples and your car!

BTW, I wouldn't go too much by the color/clarity of the oil. Just because it "looks" black or dirty doesn't mean it's spent. That usually just means it's doing exactly what it's supposed to do: cleaning (detergents you know) and suspending, and removing the particles and combustion by-products.
The way I looked at it, if it's turning black, then the quicker you get fresh oil in there, the more black stuff you will get out of your engine! That's always a good thing :) I don't know how they treated this engine the first 108K miles...so for me if the oil is coming out black then keep it comin! I want all that crap out of the engine, sooner the better :D

Sure the Toyota/Audi sludge is partially a design problem. But 3000mile OCI's and you think those engines wouldn't survive 500K? Like you said, use your common senses, oil analysis doesn't tell you that it's sludging! :yes:

The way I looked at it, if it's turning black, then the quicker you get fresh oil in there, the more black stuff you will get out of your engine! That's always a good thing :) I don't know how they treated this engine the first 108K miles...so for me if the oil is coming out black then keep it comin! I want all that crap out of the engine, sooner the better :D

Sure the Toyota/Audi sludge is partially a design problem. But 3000mile OCI's and you think those engines wouldn't survive 500K? Like you said, use your common senses, oil analysis doesn't tell you that it's sludging! :yes:

I understand the sentiment, but how dark is too much? Many cars will turn an oil black in only a few hundred miles. That doesn't mean the oil isn't protecting, just that it's doing what it's designed to do. But in your case, since you weren't the original owner, you have to do what you feel is right. As for sludge, I'm not yet "smart enough" to know if UOA's can tell you something about that or not. I'm sure some of our BITOG friends can answer that...in fact, I may pose that very question.

I understand the sentiment, but how dark is too much? Many cars will turn an oil black in only a few hundred miles.

This is true. In one of the Honda tech bulletins that Princess or someone posted, it said the the factory fill w/ high moly content can turn the engine oil dark immediately. A visual inspection of internal components (not always possible except maybe for the valve cover) or the oil itself, noticing something like your coolant is "disappearing", or a weird burning smell might be the only symtpoms something is wrong. A chemical analysis is the only way you can get a true picture of whether or not your oil is still working as effectively as possible.