Krap should I go E85???

[Metal Metalic]

Donno if I skimmed through this forum or another but someone stated it is possible to run E85 by using different injectors.

I am thinking E85 may be worth while, as it stands at $1.00 less per gallon.

I am thinking fuel mileage may succ, and the whole thing will be a wash.

I am getting tired of being jacked around by mid-west unregulated fuel pump costs.

Prices will go up 4 times a week depending on who farts or sneezes, when the same fuel has been already paid for in the main tanks.

I am truly surprised people have not purposefully damaged pumps to retaliate.

[mobiless2]

Ethanol is very corrosive. It damages rubber fuel lines. If your vehicle is not E85 than most rubber line are not designed for it. It will not be cheaper in the long run. Ask boater, and small motor repair people.

I had to purchase new lawn equipment(weeder, blower, trimmer) because of E85. The new stuff has different fuel lines.

Plus you get lower gas mileage.

[Metal Metalic]

Originally Posted by mobiless2

Ethanol is very corrosive. It damages rubber fuel lines. If your vehicle is not E85 than most rubber line are not designed for it. It will not be cheaper in the long run. Ask boater, and small motor repair people.

I had to purchase new lawn equipment(weeder, blower, trimmer) because of E85. The new stuff has different fuel lines.

Plus you get lower gas mileage.

Ah well, I figured MPG would succ.

Though 10% is the norm these days, I would figure most new cars would have fuel lines that were capable. Guess not.

So it seems there is really no savings with E85.

I wonder if any 2013 Vette owners will try using E85. It seems pointless to make Vettes that can run E85... Like, I was passing a new Vette the other day, and just as he was catching up he ran out of gas. HA!!!

[Kenwood]

Why bother, you would be rough on equipment as posted, you lose efficiency and power...

PLUS your overlooking 1 HUGE item...

Whats happening right now... DROUGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So as crop commodity futures are going sky high, so will evryhing else related... Would not surprise me to see the gap close on pricing soon.

[namegoeshere]

Originally Posted by Metal Metalic

I am truly surprised people have not purposefully damaged pumps to retaliate.

And what would that achieve? Majority of gas stations aren't company owned or operated. Owners are hurting too.

Pain at Pump Is Hitting Gas Stations

Many Independent Owners Lose Money Amid Falling Demand; Competition From Warehouse Clubs Is Another Challenge

The pain at the pump is hitting not only consumers but also the owners of America's roughly 110,000 independent gas stations.

U.S. gas consumption is estimated to be at an 11-year-low, at around 8.4 million barrels a day, down 4.3% from a year ago.

In the face of sharply declining demand for gas, Robert Fisher of Phoenix said it's increasingly difficult for him to make a profit.

"There have been times in the past month when I've been losing money for every gallon of gas I sell," said the 28-year-old, who co-owns four Chevron gas stations and convenience stores in Arizona, Oregon and Washington with his father, brother and sister. "It's a very tough industry," he said.

Lower convenience-store sales and hefty credit-card processing fees are also hurting the economics of gas-station ownership, many owners say.

"The less traffic we have on the outside translates to the less traffic we have on the inside," said Steve Cohen, who has owned a Mobil gas station and convenience store in a residential part of Elmont, N.Y., for three decades. The amount of gas he sells on average per month is down by about 80,000 gallons from a year ago. Sales of candy, beer and other items are down by about 25% over the same period. "The volume is just slowly fading away," he said.

Before fuel-efficient cars existed, and back when gas prices were relatively low, it was fairly easy for owners of stations with convenience stores in prime locations to make money. In the 1980s and 1990s, gas prices and rents were low and oil wholesalers offered incentives for station owners, said Mr. Cohen. "They used to offer rebates if you sold X amount of gas by the end of each month," he said.

Until the past five years or so, many gas stations were, in fact, owned by the big energy companies. But most have since sold off their portfolio of stations to focus on more profitable areas, such as wholesale fuel sales.


Since 2008, for instance, Exxon Mobil Corp. has sold more than 95% of the roughly 2,000 stations it owned, and it plans to sell the rest by year-end. Chevron Corp. had 491 company-owned stations at the end of 2011, down from 1,348 in 2001.

Most U.S. gas stations are owned by tens of thousands of individual operators, many of whom have one or more locations. These independent station owners typically buy their fuel from distributors for the major fuel wholesalers like Exxon Mobil and Chevron. The regional distributors own or hire tanker trucks that go from the so-called racks at gasoline terminals to storage tanks at the individual stations.

The station owners, in turn, set their gas prices for consumers so that the average markup, or gross margin, on gas is typically around 15 cents or 16 cents a gallon.

Because consumers these days use plastic even for spontaneous small purchases such as gas, snacks and smokes, the station owners say their margins are eroding. Card-processing fees are typically a percentage of sales—ranging on average from 1% to 3% depending on the card—plus a flat fee of about 10 cents per transaction.

Frank Reluzco, owner of an Exxon station, auto-repair business and convenience store in Frederick, Md., said that roughly 90% of his sales are paid by credit card today, compared with about 75% five years ago. "It costs so much to fill a tank right now; no one's going to carry around that much cash," said Mr. Reluzco.

"I'm definitely hurting," said Carl Betz, owner of a Getty station and auto-repair shop in downtown Madison, N.J., since 1988. He said the amount of gas he sells today is down about 25% from a year ago. Due to a licensing agreement, he's required to buy his fuel from Getty Petroleum Marketing Inc. of East Meadow, N.Y., which he said sometimes charges him more than what his competitors down the street pay for gas from other brands.

About 83% of gas stations in the U.S.—92,100—have convenience stores, according to IBISWorld Inc. Their ranks have declined by about 4.5% from five years ago, and their typical profit is about 2% of overall revenue, it said.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...725847318.html

Paying too much for gas? There are things you can do to fix that. Drive less, get a more fuel efficient car, walk more, ride a bike, use public transportation, car pool,....

[ElectricFuzz]

Originally Posted by Metal Metalic

Ah well, I figured MPG would succ.

Though 10% is the norm these days, I would figure most new cars would have fuel lines that were capable. Guess not.

So it seems there is really no savings with E85.

I wonder if any 2013 Vette owners will try using E85. It seems pointless to make Vettes that can run E85... Like, I was passing a new Vette the other day, and just as he was catching up he ran out of gas. HA!!!

Corvettes (Base and Z06) get mid 20's on the highway, not bad for a V8 sports car with 430/505HP.

[Danielc409]

Yea if your vehicle wasn't made to handle E85, you can expect problems. Unless you are looking for power gains, there isn't really any reasons to run it, especially since there isn't much, if any, tuning going on. The gas mileage vs price difference is negligible and basically evens itself out I'm sure.

[Pete240z]

I had an Impala that was E85. The lower cost and crappier gas mileage evened out.

I agree your asking for trouble if you don't have an E85 designed car to start with.

[leafs]

what made you want to run E85 in your car ????

[Sonnick]

You will make more power with e85. BUT, you need to be tuned for it. Not sure if the stock lines will handle it. Doubt it though.

[ZeroTX]

All cars for the past 10+ years are resistant to the corrosive nature of E85. Obviously you shouldn't run it on a 1987 model without modifying the fuel lines and such, but a 20xx model is fine. The problem is the capacity of the injectors. For many cars (not sure about ours), the injectors would top out well below redline when running E85.

As far as cost, yes it's a wash, and if you factor in the cost of the conversion parts, you're probably taking a loss.

There are kits out there to do this if it's something that truly interests you, though. Google "E85 conversion" .... In fact, the demo/video I saw of one of these was using an early 2000's CR-V as the guinea pig.

Z

[4G63attack]

I don't know about the Accords but with the Eclipse you need bigger injectors, bigger fuel pump, wide band, and something like apex-i S-AFC

[Sonnick]

If all we needed were injectors that really wouldn't be all that bad for the extra power. I'm pretty sure RDX injectors fit and would definitely be enough. If so, I'm sure we could see up to 10-12whp more tuned on e85 vs. tuned on 93.