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Hi all, hope all is well.

I was going into work yesterday morning when my tire pressure sensors tripped, I tried re calibrating them to see if it was just acting up as the sensors usually do on the Accord but as I arrived to my destination, I looked at all my tires and I found this:

522648



I took it to JiffyLube after I was off work and the guy that briefly "inspected" it told me it was unable to be repaired as the holes are too close to each-other?

Lo and behold, 5 mins later he's telling me he needs me to replace both rear tires but only one has a puncture, he quoted me 550 for 2 tires.

Then he went to the front and said "Oh, your front tire looks low too" (my front tire wasn't low as I had checked all of them).

I told him I wan't a second opinion, I have an appointment tomorrow at a different place (fingers crossed)..

But the puncture seems to be right in the middle where tire punctures are very easy to fix, but I know how unlucky I am I got this double holed metal causing 2 holes across..

I would love your guy's input on this matter, is this irreparable or do I still have hope?

Thanks in advance!
 

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I would try a local independent shop. I have plugged a lot of tires but looking at that scenario has me thinking. Never done 2 plugs that close. It could compromise the integrity of the whole area? Not sure. It all depends on your budget and comfort level. Me in my younger days would throw 2 plugs in it and roll with it, Me now with my child in the car would probably replace the tire. And IDEALLY you would never replace only one tire with a new one as the tread will be higher and cause them to potentially wear unevenly, handle funky, and probably freak out the Honda tpms system since the diameter would be different from the other side. They weren't completely BSing you but I would definitely get another opinion as those quick lube places have very aggressive commission based pay structures. I am surprised they didn't try to recommend a headlight flush while you were there! Honestly though. Its up to you. I would plug it or find a good price on a pair of tires.
 

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You can replace one tire and still be safe, as long as the tread remaining is not that worn down....as these are not all wheel drive vehicles.
He may be correct with the two patches, as they are so close, he may not be able to do it properly. The patches have to be able to lay completely flat inside the tire.
 

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I had a similar puncture - a small screw and a nail right next to each other (it looks like in the picture your tire has a staple in it). An independent garage that I did business with for years fixed my tire for the cost of taking the wheel off the car, taking the tire off the rim, inspecting the inside of the tire to assure no hidden damage, plugged the punctures and putting everything back together. I drove on that tire until I traded the car in for the Accord.

Take your car to an independent garage and stay away from Jiffy Lube.

In the picture it is clear that the wear indicator shows you have useful tread life on that tire. I think you are being up sold by Jiffy Lube, and something that should only cost $20 or $30 will end up costing you several hundred Canadian dollars.

Good luck.
 

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You can have the tire patched, not plugged. Since your punctures are in the center of the tread, there should be no no issue. A good tire shop will mark the tire to the valve stem so they can remount the tire in the same clocked position as it was prior to the repair. This will save you have to rebalance the tire.
 

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You can have the tire patched, not plugged. Since your punctures are in the center of the tread, there should be no no issue. A good tire shop will mark the tire to the valve stem so they can remount the tire in the same clocked position as it was prior to the repair. This will save you have to rebalance the tire.
A good tire shop will patch and re-balance the tire as part of the repair. Should cost ~$30. From the Tire Industry Association:

TIA Tire Repair Basics
  • The only way to properly repair a tire is to demount it from the rim so it can inspected on the inside, remove the damaged material, fill the void with rubber, and seal the innerliner with a repair unit.
  • A plug by itself or a patch by itself is not an acceptable repair because the plug does not permanently seal the innerliner and the patch does not fill the void left by the penetrating object, which allows water to enter the body of the tire and starting corroding the steel belts.
  • The use of sealants or emergency inflators that contain a sealant are not recommended as long-term solutions to a flat tire for the same reasons.
  • Puncture repairs are limited to the center of the tread area. If there are punctures or damage in the shoulder or sidewall of the tire, it is not repairable.
  • If the injuries are close enough so that the repairs overlap or the injuries are directly across from each other, the tire cannot be repaired and must be scrapped.
  • Never repair tires with a tread puncture larger that ¼-inch (6mm).
The key is the plug and patch kit, two holes next to each other could be a problem.
 

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GTFOOThat Jiffy Lube. Never, ever, ever get a tire opinion form Jiffy Lube . . . ever.

Squirt soap or spit on it and make sure both holes are leaking. If you only have one leak plug it. Otherwise take it to a tire shop like Discount tire or Walmart and have them patch it. It might cost you $20.
 
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FYI, if you decide to replace the tire, you can get tires shaved at places like Tirerack. This way, you don't have to replace both tires due to the tread difference.
 
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I am not buying the "threads slightly worn vs. new tire" thing. Not applicable to rear wheels that are idle. No problem even if it was in the front, it is an open diff anyway.

Tell me this: What makes more difference in effective wheel diameter: 1/32" difference in thread depth, or a 3 psi difference in tire pressure. Does anyone adjust the tire pressure on the passenger side when a passenger gets in/out? Does that ever upset the TPMS? Has anyone ever seen a TPMS light come on after loading up the trunk? Do we all have perfect alignment? Even the alignment specs have tolerances; they do not have to be spot on for the car to perform as designed.

While you are at it also tell me how many people check tire pressure every week, if they can do it accurately each time, how many of those gauges are calibrated accurately, and assuming acceptable calibration what is the error margin and how all that compares to 1/32" difference in thread depth. Come on, this is neither Indy car racing, nor you are about to make an attempt at breaking the land speed record. Get real.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Wow, thank you guys for the prompt replies! I really appreciate all the input.

I ended up going to an independent family owned place it was the smoothest thing I ever seen, he jacked up my car took the tire off, didn't say anything and proceeded to plug 2 holes with ease.. I said another place it wasn't fixable, and he was just flabbergasted at how simple it was.

I am so disgusted by the workers at Jiffylube, he wanted to sell me 2 tires for a simple puncture.. I was wondering if I was a person who had 0 ideas about cars and anything car related, I would get swindled right away with what he said and I would have shelled out those 550 just from his word.. seriously sad.. never going to that place ever again. Learned my lesson.

Btw this is how the metal piece looked like, I thought it was deep and bigger but it was laughably small.
IMG_20200721_131634.jpg
 

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The Jiffy Lube guy didn't mean it was physically impossible to fix. He meant that the close punctures are dangerous to plug. There are also conspiracists out there who think plugs are dangerous in themselves. The theory is that stuffing a plug into the grain of the tire puts outward pressure that can cause a tire to split. So you can see how someone could see your problem as more dangerous. I'm on my 3rd or 4th box of 50 plugs and have never had a problem. I've used tons of plugs but I think I'd have felt more at ease if he'd have patched that one. Although if it were me I'd have pulled out both pieces and made sure they were actually leaking before I plugged both. And I'm sure I'd have plugged them both.

 
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The Jiffy Lube guy didn't mean it was physically impossible to fix. He meant that the close punctures are dangerous to plug. There are also conspiracists out there who think plugs are dangerous in themselves. The theory is that stuffing a plug into the grain of the tire puts outward pressure that can cause a tire to split. I'm on my 3rd or 4th box of 50 plugs and have never had a problem. So you can see how someone could see your problem as more dangerous. Like I say, I've used tons of plugs but I think I'd have felt more at ease if he'd have patched that one. Although if it were me I'd have pulled out both pieces and made sure they were actually leaking before I plugged both. And I'm sure I'd have plugged them both.

Totally understand his POV if he actually took the time to jack up my car and take off my tire to get a closer look..

He just took a 3 min look outside the garage, told me to reverse so he can see it more clearly and he came to the conclusion right away that it "no-one can do it for me" and that I should scrap the tire as he proceed to give me a quote for tires.

Something about his approach was very ingenuine, gave me bad vibes right away..
 

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Looks like you ran over a staple used for home electrical wiring. Glad the hear the fix worked out to your satisfaction
 

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He surely tried to hose you.

As far as those staple pieces being small. I've seen screws in my tire and when I pulled them out prepared to plug them they weren't long enough to cause a leak. That's always refreshing.
 
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Something about his approach was very ingenuine, gave me bad vibes right away..
Leave a negative review on Yelp!

I am not buying the "threads slightly worn vs. new tire" thing. Not applicable to rear wheels that are idle. No problem even if it was in the front, it is an open diff anyway.

Tell me this: What makes more difference in effective wheel diameter: 1/32" difference in thread depth, or a 3 psi difference in tire pressure. Does anyone adjust the tire pressure on the passenger side when a passenger gets in/out? Does that ever upset the TPMS? Has anyone ever seen a TPMS light come on after loading up the trunk? Do we all have perfect alignment? Even the alignment specs have tolerances; they do not have to be spot on for the car to perform as designed.

While you are at it also tell me how many people check tire pressure every week, if they can do it accurately each time, how many of those gauges are calibrated accurately, and assuming acceptable calibration what is the error margin and how all that compares to 1/32" difference in thread depth. Come on, this is neither Indy car racing, nor you are about to make an attempt at breaking the land speed record. Get real.
Well said. I never thought of it this way.

I wanted to add, the new-ish Toyota Rav4 Hybrid with AWD has an electric motor for the rear wheels. If the sensor detects one "old" worn out tire and one new tire- it simply disengages the rear wheel drive system so as to not damage anything. So many places still say "you must replace all four tires!"
 

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Leave a negative review on Yelp!



Well said. I never thought of it this way.

I wanted to add, the new-ish Toyota Rav4 Hybrid with AWD has an electric motor for the rear wheels. If the sensor detects one "old" worn out tire and one new tire- it simply disengages the rear wheel drive system so as to not damage anything. So many places still say "you must replace all four tires!"
I'm not sure I like that and that sounds like something Toyota can get sued for. If tires are wearing unevenly due to bad alignment or maybe got a flat and had to use the "donut", AWD system should not turn off. What if the user gets in a pinch where they need AWD but car's ECU says no, your tires are uneven. User gets hurt from frost bite from being stuck in snow. Interesting that Toyota would do that considering. At least give the user choice or ability to override it.
 

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I'm not sure I like that and that sounds like something Toyota can get sued for. If tires are wearing unevenly due to bad alignment or maybe got a flat and had to use the "donut", AWD system should not turn off. What if the user gets in a pinch where they need AWD but car's ECU says no, your tires are uneven. User gets hurt from frost bite from being stuck in snow. Interesting that Toyota would do that considering. At least give the user choice or ability to override it.
Sued?

If your Accord detects that you are trying to exceed 135 mph at wide open throttle, it will cut off fuel momentarily to keep you below that speed. What if drug lords were chasing you, trying to kill or cause great bodily harm? User gets hurt from bullet wounds. Can Honda be sued?

Anyway, it's in the Toyota owner's manual.
 

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Sued?

If your Accord detects that you are trying to exceed 135 mph at wide open throttle, it will cut off fuel momentarily to keep you below that speed. What if drug lords were chasing you, trying to kill or cause great bodily harm? User gets hurt from bullet wounds. Can Honda be sued?

Anyway, it's in the Toyota owner's manual.
I'm not saying user would win but it does open up a question of legality and litigation risk. Crashing due to illegal speed of 135 mph and trying to sue Honda would get tossed by the judge. Having AWD disabled because two tires have uneven thread can't be compared to driving felony speeds.
 

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Veeeeery interesting...a list of features that MAY not work when using a compact spare on the RAV4 Hybrid;

"The vehicle speed may not be correctly detected, and the following systems may not operate correctly:•
ABS & Brake assist•
VSC/Trailer Sway Control•
TRAC• Dynamic radar cruise control with full-speed range•
Dynamic radar cruise control•
PCS (Pre-Collision System)•
EPS• LTA (Lane Tracing Assist) •
Tire pressure warning system (if equipped)•
AHB (Automatic High Beam)•
BSM (Blind Spot Monitor) (if equipped)•
Downhill assist control system (if equipped)•
Rear view monitor system (if equipped)•
Panoramic view monitor (if equipped)•
Toyota parking assist monitor (if equipped)•
Intuitive parking assist (if equipped)•
Navigation system (if equipped)

Also, not only can the following systems not be utilized fully, but they may actually negatively affect the drive-train components:• Dynamic Torque Control AWD system (if equipped)"
 

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Veeeeery interesting...a list of features that MAY not work when using a compact spare on the RAV4 Hybrid;

"The vehicle speed may not be correctly detected, and the following systems may not operate correctly:•
ABS & Brake assist•
VSC/Trailer Sway Control•
TRAC• Dynamic radar cruise control with full-speed range•
Dynamic radar cruise control•
PCS (Pre-Collision System)•
EPS• LTA (Lane Tracing Assist) •
Tire pressure warning system (if equipped)•
AHB (Automatic High Beam)•
BSM (Blind Spot Monitor) (if equipped)•
Downhill assist control system (if equipped)•
Rear view monitor system (if equipped)•
Panoramic view monitor (if equipped)•
Toyota parking assist monitor (if equipped)•
Intuitive parking assist (if equipped)•
Navigation system (if equipped)

Also, not only can the following systems not be utilized fully, but they may actually negatively affect the drive-train components:• Dynamic Torque Control AWD system (if equipped)"
Interesting indeed. Learned something new today. Although I still wonder why. But then, Toyota as well as Honda are run by groups of engineers, attorneys and many more people far smarter than me. I'm sure they ruled pros and cons and decided that this is the correct way to proceed.
 
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