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Discussion Starter #21
OK, HOW???? what prevents the car from driving away. I don't see a way to do this that doesn't end in disaster for someone else
I am not an engineer but it seems to me that cars are all now "drive by wire"... that is, there is no mechanical linkage from the gas peddle to the engine... and no physical linkage between the transmission lever and the transmission without computer processing in between... so how hard would it be to design the Smart Key system to block shifting into Drive or Reverse with the engine running... without the Smart Key being inside the car?
 

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I will add that i do not like the push button start simply because I appreciate the ability to start a car with a 100% dead battery with manual transmission, and this is not possible anymore. I also miss the handbrake, or at least wish they'd allow me to start the car with the brake already released
 

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@GlobeKing500 - Maybe you need to change the settings for the Security RelockTimer from 30 sec (default, at least in my '16) to 90 sec.

Security RelockTimer
Changes the time it takes for the doors to relock and the security system to set after you unlock the vehicle without opening either door.
 

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design the Smart Key system to block shifting into Drive or Reverse with the engine running
So lets pretend you have this system in place and your fob dies one day on the road. now you're crippled in the exact same way, except it can rear its ugly head when you're trying to turn around on a roadway, parking lot, or some other inconvenient location. the current system allows the vehicle to safely reach a safe destination (parking space, driveway, rest stop) before the vehicle is disabled.

I'll throw you a bone, I agree that it is a bad design, but there are a lot of worse alternatives out there and so far nothing that is really any better. Plus, your wife would have been equally screwed with this situation UNLESS she put the car in park when you exited. There's no way to guarantee that the driver is the person carrying the key, i have the key in my pocket as passenger once in a while because i know it works and it's my key chain.

Yes, I dislike the push button, but other than eliminating the option, there's nothing you can do to improve the system.
 

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Discussion Starter #25
Maybe you need to change the settings for the Security RelockTimer from 30 sec (default, at least in my '16) to 90 sec.

Yes, that will definitely help with the grocery bags problem... thank you
 

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How do I want it to work?? Very simple... you should NOT be able to drive away without the key being inside the car... Also, what does happen if the signal from the Smart Key is lost? ...this my concern with this kind of technology... suppose the Smart Key battery becomes weak or goes dead...apparently you will be unable to start the car... this could be problematic depending upon where it happens... so how is this Smart Key an improvement over the traditional key??

View attachment 518640
View attachment 518641
Like the pictures show, you can just stick the key close to the button when the battery dies.

I am just gonna say I like the keyless start on my RX-8. I really like the convenience of it. Going back to the Accord with a traditional key is a definite downgrade. And yes, I locked myself out of the Accord once because I accidentally dumped the key in the trunk.

My advice is get a key pouch you attach to your clothing instead of putting the key in your coat. This might help you be more aware of where the key is.

As for the beeping and flashing light part, I am very much amazed how some people can't notice their turn signal is stuck on with the constant clicking sound and flashing turn signal. So you know, always a possibility people don't notice.

And to counter your argument, if the key suddenly dies for whatever reason, your car will stop in the middle of a road. Not good.

Sent from GM1917. Technology!
 

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so how hard would it be to design the Smart Key system to block shifting into Drive or Reverse with the engine running... without the Smart Key being inside the car?
The car and key were designed to operate the way that it does; whether we like it, understand it, or don't like it, it was done for a reason. It was not a mistake or an oversight. Ironically, nearly every facet of modern vehicles are designed to save us from ourselves.

Really not trying to sound condescending but ultimately you have two options:

1) Understand the features and functionality of your vehicle and operate it properly.
2) Sell it and get something you like better and that you feel is designed and operates better for you.
 

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I will add that i do not like the push button start simply because I appreciate the ability to start a car with a 100% dead battery with manual transmission, and this is not possible anymore. I also miss the handbrake, or at least wish they'd allow me to start the car with the brake already released
Gonna be honest, I never really saw the whole push start for MT thing as an advantage. There are too many factors that have to align for it to work in real life, like you have to be facing downhill or you have to have passengers in the car to push it for you(for reference, I drive alone for the most part). Most modern cars also warn you not to do so due to the possible damage it can inflict on emission systems.

Besides, if your battery is dead enough(as you said, 100% dead) for the ignition and fuel injection system to not work, my understanding is that push start will also not work. I would think you at least have to have enough juice to have these 2 systems working.

I drive a MT because it's more fun. That's really it. Everything else is more or less just a bonus or a cost to play.

The car and key were designed to operate the way that it does; whether we like it, understand it, or don't like it, it was done for a reason. It was not a mistake or an oversight. Ironically, nearly every facet of modern vehicles are designed to save us from ourselves.

Really not trying to sound condescending but ultimately you have two options:

1) Understand the features and functionality of your vehicle and operate it properly.
2) Sell it and get something you like better and that you feel is designed and operates better for you.
I wouldn't be surprised if they ran through this decision with the lawyer team to see which one is the least likely to leave Honda liable to the damage/accident in the worse case scenario of each design.

With this one, at worst you just have your car jacked by someone, which is better than having it stop in the middle of a highway and rammed into by other cars go at 70+mph.

Sent from GM1917. Technology!
 

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Discussion Starter #29
So lets pretend you have this system in place and your fob dies one day on the road. now you're crippled in the exact same way, except it can rear its ugly head when you're trying to turn around on a roadway, parking lot, or some other inconvenient location. the current system allows the vehicle to safely reach a safe destination (parking space, driveway, rest stop) before the vehicle is disabled.

I'll throw you a bone, I agree that it is a bad design, but there are a lot of worse alternatives out there and so far nothing that is really any better. Plus, your wife would have been equally screwed with this situation UNLESS she put the car in park when you exited. There's no way to guarantee that the driver is the person carrying the key, i have the key in my pocket as passenger once in a while because i know it works and it's my key chain.

Yes, I dislike the push button, but other than eliminating the option, there's nothing you can do to improve the system.

Yes, you are correct that would be another problem... there is no easy solution. Sometimes less is more... keep it simple... I wish I still had my 66 Ford Mustang that I had in my youth... straight 6... easy to work on ...simplicity itself... no Smart Key technology! All this advancing technology is a house of cards... if you have the time pick up a copy of a book "One Second After" written by a North Carolina college professor critical of technology and the disaster that potentially awaits us when things go terribly wrong...
 

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I'd rather not screw with carburetors, or smell exhaust fumes, or have no traction control whatsoever(Mustangs are bad enough with the whole crowd crashing with traction control), or have it collapse on me like a tin can if someone runs into me. I value these a whole lot more than simplicity.

Now don't get me wrong, classic cars are cool, but as daily drivers they are just not the best choice for the reasons stated above.

And yes, some modern cars are overdoing it with the tech, but going to the other extreme is also not the solution.

Sent from GM1917. Technology!
 

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Besides, if your battery is dead enough(as you said, 100% dead) for the ignition and fuel injection system to not work, my understanding is that push start will also not work. I would think you at least have to have enough juice to have these 2 systems working.
Oh it can be done, the battery just gets it started, once that alternator starts turning, you're golden. My 1995 accord had a battery that would keep the lights on for about 4 seconds after the ignition turned off, it was well and truly dead. I parked on a hill at my apartment complex, and used a starter pack when i couldn't do that for about 2 months. being broke sucks, but i pulled it off until a guy i knew bought a battery for me in exchange for labor.
 

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My car beeps pretty pretty loud if I walk away with the fob while the car is running. I'm not sure if you missed it somehow (possibly loud surroundings) but it's pretty unmistakable and quite annoying.

Hopefully your wife wasn't stranded for too long.

I'd rather not screw with carburetors, or smell exhaust fumes, or have no traction control whatsoever(Mustangs are bad enough with the whole crowd crashing with traction control), or have it collapse on me like a tin can if someone runs into me. I value these a whole lot more than simplicity.
My friend wanted to drive my 5.0 with all of safety features disabled. I let him try. He couldn't believe how fast that car loses grip. We were in an empty parking lot, safely away from anyone when he dumped the clutch at 6000 rpms. He said "I see why so many people wreck these cars."

I love most of the technology. Especially traction and stability with 420 hp.
 

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What about a lanyard from a Jet Ski rental in Cancun? You attach the Honda lanyard to your wrist, and the car will not start unless the wrist circuit is complete and attached- or your seat shocks you with high voltage?
518642


This will prevent the car from operating should you be thrown from the vehicle in the event of a crash.

Or do what my local Pep Boys does with bathroom keys- attach them to something heavy and obnoxious, so that you and everyone else knows who has the keys.
518645
 

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I'm going to say this one is on your wife. When you both got out the car to trade places you left the driver side door open for her so there was no beep. You probably started walking away so you were far enough away to not hear the beep when she closed the door and she didn't hear it because she was inside the car. But how could she drive any distance without noticing the the warning in the cluster? I've had my car running with the key not on me and that's the first thing I notice as I sit.
 

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Yes, you are correct that would be another problem... there is no easy solution. Sometimes less is more... keep it simple... I wish I still had my 66 Ford Mustang that I had in my youth... straight 6... easy to work on ...simplicity itself... no Smart Key technology! All this advancing technology is a house of cards... if you have the time pick up a copy of a book "One Second After" written by a North Carolina college professor critical of technology and the disaster that potentially awaits us when things go terribly wrong...

I remember old carbureted engines. They required frequent tune-ups: spark plug replacement, timing settings, carb adjustments. They had drivability issues depending on weather and ambient temps, lousy fuel economy, limited power, high emissions. How anyone can think a modern engine with its computer controlled fuel/air/ignition is not an improvement over old-style carbureted engines defies logic. In terms of powertrains more is definitely better when it comes to technology.
 

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I'm going to say this one is on your wife. When you both got out the car to trade places you left the driver side door open for her so there was no beep. You probably started walking away so you were far enough away to not hear the beep when she closed the door and she didn't hear it because she was inside the car. But how could she drive any distance without noticing the the warning in the cluster? I've had my car running with the key not on me and that's the first thing I notice as I sit.
Some people just want to blame others for their own failings
 

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I remember old carbureted engines. They required frequent tune-ups: spark plug replacement, timing settings, carb adjustments. They had drivability issues depending on weather and ambient temps, lousy fuel economy, limited power, high emissions. How anyone can think a modern engine with its computer controlled fuel/air/ignition is not an improvement over old-style carbureted engines defies logic. In terms of powertrains more is definitely better when it comes to technology.
Not to mention all the safety improvements like air bags, stability control, etc. Airplanes have gone through a similar technology advancement helping us to have the best safety record ever. Techology can be frustrating (just think of computer crashes, etc.) but I love the smart key functionality. I have never ever locked my key in my car once when driving a car with a smart key.
lost my keys once with my phone locked in the car. Used my apple watch to call my wife for the spare key. Glad I had that technology too!
 

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Discussion Starter #40
I am not a Luddite or a follower of Ted Kacyznski... but he may have been correct about advancing technology being a monster... in any event, Honda has made a serious error here with their Smart Key technology... no car should be able to be driven away without the key present in the car... it is just plain dumb.
 
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