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Any idea what American Honda Fit sales were in recent years? Honda just canned the Fit in the American market, so those numbers could give us a pretty good indicator of what Honda considers to be worth keeping or not, and whether or not the Accord is truly safe.
In 2018 and 2019, Honda sold about 35,000 Fits in the US.

On the other hand, the Ridgeline remained in production for six years while selling half that number.
 

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Honda Sales 2019

Yep. It looks like around 35k for each of the last two years.
The Fit was in an awkward position though. It was small, somewhat underpowered, low profit margin (relatively lower MSRP), plus Honda probably figure more people will likely go to the higher priced Civic or HR-V’s anyways, so the incentive for them to keep the model is probably not great to begin with... the low sales volume just pretty much sealed its fate.
 

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Earlier this year, Honda announced they would be working with GM to develop two new electric vehicles with Honda-exclusive sheet metal and interiors built on a GM platform.

More recently, Honda revealed a much deeper relationship that is planned to involve not only electric vehicles, but also internal combustion engines, electrical architecture, advanced driver assist systems, infotainment, connectivity, purchasing, research, and development.

The Accord is a very good sedan, but it's not #1 in sales - that title goes to the Camry. It's not Honda's #1 seller, either - that title goes to CR-V followed by the Civic and then the Accord.
Well, close enough.
 

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Earlier this year, Honda announced they would be working with GM to develop two new electric vehicles with Honda-exclusive sheet metal and interiors built on a GM platform.
New details: The new Honda electric crossover will be built by GM in Mexico. The new Acura electric crossover will be built by GM in Tennessee alongside the Cadillac Lyriq.

The Accord is a very good sedan, but it's not #1 in sales - that title goes to the Camry. It's not Honda's #1 seller, either - that title goes to CR-V followed by the Civic and then the Accord.
Toyota sold 294,348 Camrys in 2020 which is down 12.7% over 2019.

Honda sold 199,458 Accords in 2020 which is down 25.5% over 2019. Ouch.

Honda also sold 333,502 CR-Vs, 261,225 Civics, and 123,813 Pilots.

There's still some life left in the Accord, but I predict it will eventually wave a white flag in front of the Camry.
 

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Toyota hotted up the Camry (and Corolla) to attract younger customers. And it is a nice looking car but I highly doubt Honda will let the Accord go. If anything, they would fancy up same as what Toyota did.
 

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images of the next civic have been released...looks exactly like a mini 10th gen accord. What will the new 11th gen accord look like then? do you guys think the body styling will remain very similar to the 10th gen? Is there any hope for the manual transmission to make a comeback with the accord? there are rumblings that the 2022 mazda6 will be a inline 6 with RWD and possible manual transmission. Very curious about the future of the accord.
 

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images of the next civic have been released...looks exactly like a mini 10th gen accord. What will the new 11th gen accord look like then? do you guys think the body styling will remain very similar to the 10th gen? Is there any hope for the manual transmission to make a comeback with the accord? there are rumblings that the 2022 mazda6 will be a inline 6 with RWD and possible manual transmission. Very curious about the future of the accord.
Accord and civic getting less and less different with each iteration, it's almost time a bean counter deems one of them redundant. Numbers don't look great for accord. They already axed the coupe and the MT. With fewer configurations the overhead should come down. Will it be enough to justify keeping both cars we will see. My guess is it should be. Accord being an FF car with inline 4 engine and open diff is already the cheapest type of car to make.

Mazda on the other hand kept miata alive and up to date while honda killed S2000 (yes, there are rumors of a 2024 model year S2000, but there are rumors about the moon being an alien spaceship, too), so I find it easy to expect low volume enthusiast cars from mazda.

Toyota went down the same road Honda is now headed over a decade ago. They are now scrambling to make half cocked efforts to bring the sporty image back with what I consider an insult to everything Supra was. Although I am very curious about Yaris GR.

Look at hyundai and their veloster N. Look at Kia Stinger. Where is Honda's halo car? Is civic type r it? I find it kinda underwhelming tbh.

Or maybe honda is taking an entirely different turn and focusing on alternative fuels?
 

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“Rumblings”, huh? A Mazda6 will never be RWD.
"The next-generation 6, which should be on sale by the end of 2022, is set to get a full Bavarian, transitioning to a longitudinal-engine platform with rear-wheel drive and an inline-six."

 

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Look at hyundai and their veloster N. Look at Kia Stinger. Where is Honda's halo car? Is civic type r it? I find it kinda underwhelming tbh.
Honda has the NSX...
 

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View attachment 527092

No.

“Rumblings”, huh? A Mazda6 will never be RWD.
www.caranddriver.com/news/amp32109038/mazda-6-rwd-confirmed-2022/

527094
Also, you really don't see the similarities between the 2022 civic and 10th gen? Looks like nearly the same vehicle!

I'll get the next mazda 6 if its even close to what they are saying it will be, Especially if MT is offered. I bought a 2021 accord this year and I am enjoying it immensely, but put off that the MT was yanked. The only options for MT accords in my area are high mileage and from previous generations with weak technology compared to the 10th gen. The 10th gen technology is hands down the best I have used...the infotainment setup is awesome. It beats my girls mazda set up by far, which I find clunky and difficult to use while driving. I am also mildly annoyed by the accords reminders (check the rear seat before exiting the vehicle!, make sure rear passengers are wearing seatbelts!) Which unfortunately cannot be turned off and are displayed even if you're the only person in the car! That being said, the accord is an awesome vehicle that fits all my needs to a T and looks great doing so. I'm just excited / anxious to see the future of the model.
 

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"The next-generation 6, which should be on sale by the end of 2022, is set to get a full Bavarian, transitioning to a longitudinal-engine platform with rear-wheel drive and an inline-six."

I’ll believe it when I see it.

am also mildly annoyed by the accords reminders (check the rear seat before exiting the vehicle!, make sure rear passengers are wearing seatbelts!) Which unfortunately cannot be turned off and are displayed even if you're the only person in the car!
Annoying are the warnings in a new MINI. My wife’s car will ding at you for over 60 seconds if you unbuckle a seatbelt (any occupant) before switching off the engine. The infotainment screen will even admonish you to buckle seatbelt while maneuvering.
 

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Annoying are the warnings in a new MINI. My wife’s car will ding at you for over 60 seconds if you unbuckle a seatbelt (any occupant) before switching off the engine. The infotainment screen will even admonish you to buckle seatbelt while maneuvering.
I cannot stand those "nanny" features, sounds awful. My accord won't bother me with anything like that unless driving above a certain speed, which I think is around 10 mph just going off memory.
 

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Veloster N, Kia Stinger, Focus ST, Golf R, Honda NSX.

One of these is not like the others.
Had to reread your last post, I answered wrong. Based on this list, it would be the Civic Type R. The Type R is a very impressive car, depending on which metrics you are using, it is actually a better car than most on this list.
 

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New details: The new Honda electric crossover will be built by GM in Mexico. The new Acura electric crossover will be built by GM in Tennessee alongside the Cadillac Lyriq.



Toyota sold 294,348 Camrys in 2020 which is down 12.7% over 2019.

Honda sold 199,458 Accords in 2020 which is down 25.5% over 2019. Ouch.

Honda also sold 333,502 CR-Vs, 261,225 Civics, and 123,813 Pilots.

There's still some life left in the Accord, but I predict it will eventually wave a white flag in front of the Camry.
Honda Accord has been losing in sales to the Camry consistently for years. In the past, however, we can always say it’s due to fleet sales to rental agencies (and that is true for the most part). With that said, I doubt there was much fleet sale to speak of in the Covid year. Even then Accord still lost by 100k units..... that is a bit concerning. If Honda doesn’t bounce back this year or the next (2022 model year), then yes, it’s future is in jeopardy. We might not have a 12th gen after all.
Toyota hotted up the Camry (and Corolla) to attract younger customers. And it is a nice looking car but I highly doubt Honda will let the Accord go. If anything, they would fancy up same as what Toyota did.
I’ve been on a test drive with a friend for a 2020 Camry SE (even drove briefly before handing it back to her, I was just there to make sure the dealers didn’t murder her on the negotiating / overall transaction). Nice car, but to me Honda has nothing to worry about with the Accord judging by the car alone. I’d personally take the Accord over the Camry any day of the week. With that said, the Camry’s not far behind at all, and with the incentives (my friend was able to get about 6k off with just a few calls/emails on our end), and the notion that Camry being more reliable (which might be the case given Honda’s gone turbo...), means that I hope Honda will pull off a fantastic 11th gen to ensure buyers (like myself) that there will be a great 12th gen down the road. Also, they need to make better commercials for the Accord like Toyota’s doing for all their cars. Honda’s commercials are great for the civic and CR-V. But their Accord commercials are lacking, if not downright terrible when I did see them in the past.
"The next-generation 6, which should be on sale by the end of 2022, is set to get a full Bavarian, transitioning to a longitudinal-engine platform with rear-wheel drive and an inline-six."

Great! I think this will be a great move for Mazda while not impacting the Accord too much.
 

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Honda Accord has been losing in sales to the Camry consistently for years. In the past, however, we can always say it’s due to fleet sales to rental agencies (and that is true for the most part). With that said, I doubt there was much fleet sale to speak of in the Covid year. Even then Accord still lost by 100k units..... that is a bit concerning. If Honda doesn’t bounce back this year or the next (2022 model year), then yes, it’s future is in jeopardy. We might not have a 12th gen after all.
I've heard (and probably even used!) the "fleet sales" excuse for years to justify why the Camry outsells the Accord. But, does it really matter who the buyers are? A sale is a sale, no?. Sure - there's less profit for the automaker for fleet sales, but there's still some profit or they wouldn't be selling them.

At least in terms of features, performance, design, and handling, the Accord is a great sedan. Why are more buyers choosing Camry? Is it because the Camry offers a softer ride that is more in line with the expectations of remaining sedan buyers? Is it because consumers are finally wising up to Honda's quality issues? Is it because buyers prefer naturally-aspirated engines and stepped automatic transmissions instead of CVTs?
 

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I've heard (and probably even used!) the "fleet sales" excuse for years to justify why the Camry outsells the Accord. But, does it really matter who the buyers are? A sale is a sale, no?. Sure - there's less profit for the automaker for fleet sales, but there's still some profit or they wouldn't be selling them.

At least in terms of features, performance, design, and handling, the Accord is a great sedan. Why are more buyers choosing Camry? Is it because the Camry offers a softer ride that is more in line with the expectations of remaining sedan buyers? Is it because consumers are finally wising up to Honda's quality issues? Is it because buyers prefer naturally-aspirated engines and stepped automatic transmissions instead of CVTs?
True. My guess is that Honda probably somehow gathered that their Accord buyers care more about the resale values than the average Camry buyer, so they had to do what they can to keep them happy. Given the Accord resale would probably plummet significantly, if they were to do fleet sales like Toyota does. They’re hoping to keep the values of the cars by withholding / limiting the number of Accords from fleet sales. It probably does end up achieving what most of the Accord buyers want, but at the cost of Honda losing the title of “The number 1 selling midsize family car.”

As far as your points as to why many choose Camry. You’ve brought up great points, the ride and quietness are what I have been able to observe as well. I’d also like to throw in that the stereo sound system... on average, Toyota kicks Honda’s ass in the sound system category. I don’t mean just what’s already included, but they also have optional Premium stereo a la carte, making it an attractive Alternative for those who really care about it. Yes, the Accord has it down on the interior design, yes the Accord is better on overall features, yes the Accord is better on driving dynamics. But for buyers who don’t care those qualities as much as everything else, as well as the better perceived (I’m adding perceived because I think they’re very close) reliability and huge incentives that Toyota offers, the Camry is undeniably an almost irresistible choice.
 

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Just for fun...

2018 Accord EX MSRP = $27,470
2018 Camry XLE MSRP = $28,450

KBB trade-in value today:

Accord $16,450 (60% of original MSRP)
Camry $16,691 (59% of original MSRP)
 

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Just for fun...

2018 Accord EX MSRP = $27,470
2018 Camry XLE MSRP = $28,450

KBB trade-in value today:

Accord $16,450 (60% of original MSRP)
Camry $16,691 (59% of original MSRP)
Haha good point. It’s a bit closer than I expected, I must say.
 
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