[Hudouc]

Vacuum Lines

Not a full chapter, but still important.

In response to @Inspire2.4 's question from 11 month ago, I did attempt to set up a constant vacuum with a catch can for the PCV and valve cover vent in March. It did NOT work.

I don't have any actual picture, but this is how I setup the system.

The catch can did collect a bit of oil and moisture, but this setup clearly did not generate enough vacuum. The crankcase pressure was high enough to push oil past the oil control ring on the turbo from both the compressor side and the turbine side. I ended up with an exhaust and an intake system completely drenched in oil. It took me 6 hours to completely tearing down the charge pipes and to clean them with soap, water, and goo gone. I went back to venting the crank case to atmosphere and leaving the PCV system stock.

 

[Inspire2.4]

As if the hottest thread on 8G forum need a bump, but I found something I thought you could use. Doctor says I'm not bipolar but I think I am so sorry for too many posts on your thread in advance...

So our Honda engines make lots of revving power but not so much below 3500rpm (imo, might be due to the runner change @ 3500). What can turn high rev, horsepower into torque? A torque converter. A more slippy one compared to OEM. I don't think it will hurt the gas fund, at least not noticeably from my observation of lockup clutch over 30k miles. Our 4cyl trans (B90A or B9OA???, for TSX : M91A, probably modified to take manual gear commands) has 2-stage lockup so daily driving mpg shouldn't be affected too much.

I have been literally searching for them since the second month I got this car after noticing the A/T would try to find the perfect gear but in 4th it's too weak and in 3nd it's revving too high, you know those roads. Solution? As a long time Mopar fan I've heard a lot about torque converter. Simply, it eats HP(amount of work) and takes some energy away as heat and gives you higher-than-input torque output(more force) just like a reduction gear but without mechanical linkage. I won't pollute your thread with what is the "real stall" of the converter and stuff so let's just use the repair manual way (brake stall).

AFAIK if you install a slightly small, or even just interally modified torque converter you can raise stall from ~2200 (IIRC which was the spec for 5.7 Hemi cars) to what they market as "2800rpm" TC. At first I was scared to try because I thought, I have to rev it to 2800 to get the car moving every time?!?! But thankfully that's not what it was. Car just creeped a little slower and I wouldn't be able to tell once I'd gotten use to it. In fact, I felt the drivability was improved in a way that the TC(unlocked) had some damping to absorb abrupt accelerator inputs.

The only downside is the extra heat generated/wasted inside TC but you already have a bottom-of-the-rad temp regulator and air cooler to shed extra heat, I think it would help your car get in the boost a little early and minimize the losses coming from dropping out of the "power zone" every shift.

Lastly I'd like to share my Google findings I believe worth asking for a custom build.
First link is what I've been seeing for past year, although they don't specifically mention our B90A but might be worth a call. I am not bothering them for now because I'm not ready to purchase.

Honda Supercharger | Honda Torque Converter | Honda Performance Transmission

Honda superchargers, rebuild kits, performance transmissions, torque converters, & more! Everything you need to supercharge your Honda.

www.levelten.com

And this thing, just popped up as I was searching for the link to the first one on GOogle.

Honda Automatic Transmission Torque Converter Accord CR-V Element RSX TSX Acura 4 Cylinder

Check out the deal on Honda Automatic Transmission Torque Converter Accord CR-V Element RSX TSX Acura 4 Cylinder at Oregon Performance Transmission

www.oregonperformancetransmission.com

According to this website it appears that 8G Accord uses same torque converter as 1G TSX... that might lead me to more search options.
I'm a little iffy about their B9OA designation (Bee-nine-oh-ey instead of B-ninety-A), but fingers crossed.

P.S. : If they say they can't make just 1, I might be able to jump on with you in a not-so-near future but I will keep an eye out.

 

[Hudouc]

As if the hottest thread on 8G forum need a bump, but I found something I thought you could use. Doctor says I'm not bipolar but I think I am so sorry for too many posts on your thread in advance...

So our Honda engines make lots of revving power but not so much below 3500rpm (imo, might be due to the runner change @ 3500). What can turn high rev, horsepower into torque? A torque converter. A more slippy one compared to OEM. I don't think it will hurt the gas fund, at least not noticeably from my observation of lockup clutch over 30k miles. Our 4cyl trans (B90A or B9OA???, for TSX : M91A, probably modified to take manual gear commands) has 2-stage lockup so daily driving mpg shouldn't be affected too much.

I have been literally searching for them since the second month I got this car after noticing the A/T would try to find the perfect gear but in 4th it's too weak and in 3nd it's revving too high, you know those roads. Solution? As a long time Mopar fan I've heard a lot about torque converter. Simply, it eats HP(amount of work) and takes some energy away as heat and gives you higher-than-input torque output(more force) just like a reduction gear but without mechanical linkage. I won't pollute your thread with what is the "real stall" of the converter and stuff so let's just use the repair manual way (brake stall).

AFAIK if you install a slightly small, or even just interally modified torque converter you can raise stall from ~2200 (IIRC which was the spec for 5.7 Hemi cars) to what they market as "2800rpm" TC. At first I was scared to try because I thought, I have to rev it to 2800 to get the car moving every time?!?! But thankfully that's not what it was. Car just creeped a little slower and I wouldn't be able to tell once I'd gotten use to it. In fact, I felt the drivability was improved in a way that the TC(unlocked) had some damping to absorb abrupt accelerator inputs.

The only downside is the extra heat generated/wasted inside TC but you already have a bottom-of-the-rad temp regulator and air cooler to shed extra heat, I think it would help your car get in the boost a little early and minimize the losses coming from dropping out of the "power zone" every shift.

Lastly I'd like to share my Google findings I believe worth asking for a custom build.
First link is what I've been seeing for past year, although they don't specifically mention our B90A but might be worth a call. I am not bothering them for now because I'm not ready to purchase.

Honda Supercharger | Honda Torque Converter | Honda Performance Transmission

Honda superchargers, rebuild kits, performance transmissions, torque converters, & more! Everything you need to supercharge your Honda.

www.levelten.com

And this thing, just popped up as I was searching for the link to the first one on GOogle.

Honda Automatic Transmission Torque Converter Accord CR-V Element RSX TSX Acura 4 Cylinder

Check out the deal on Honda Automatic Transmission Torque Converter Accord CR-V Element RSX TSX Acura 4 Cylinder at Oregon Performance Transmission

www.oregonperformancetransmission.com

According to this website it appears that 8G Accord uses same torque converter as 1G TSX... that might lead me to more search options.
I'm a little iffy about their B9OA designation (Bee-nine-oh-ey instead of B-ninety-A), but fingers crossed.

P.S. : If they say they can't make just 1, I might be able to jump on with you in a not-so-near future but I will keep an eye out.

Hmm, this is tempting. Thanks for the information.

I think eventually, I want go with a 6MT swap with the Gear-X gears (Preferably to just buy a TSX SE with the 6MT). The much closer gear ratio would allow the car to utilize the high revving characteristic of the K24Z. I just really don't trust the clutches even with a custom build trans.

There's a 2nd gen TSX on Acurazine that's making 515whp and 445wtq on the 5AT (23psi). It trapped 13.34 at 116mph. The owner did complain about the off the line performance, so a high stall converter can definitely help. But, boosted 9th gen Si can run that trap speed and get there 1 sec quicker with 100whp less and half the boost. So it looks like the MT is the way to go unless the AT can be re-geared.

New Turbo CU2 in the mix - AcuraZine - Acura Enthusiast Community

2G TSX Performance Parts & Modifications - New Turbo CU2 in the mix - Well in case anyone was wondering i was the lucky guy who was able to purchase the turbo kit built by Utah from Optimusaccord. Install is all finished now and started doing tunes with Vit Threw some pics in of finished install...

acurazine.com

Here's a company that makes sequentials for us.

Quaife Honda FWD Sequentials - B-Series, K-Series & FK2 Compatible

Learn more about our range of Honda FWD sequentials. Included is the Quaife QKE8J 5-Speed Sequential Gearkit for EP3 iterations of the Civic.

www.quaife.co.uk

 

[Inspire2.4]

Heck yeah, MT is the best way to get most fun. I am trying to stay automatic, not have 10+k$ for turbo (and running 87 octane too), and still feel a little more powerful.

Quaife, the wildcat gear company, I remember when they first came out with Chrysler LX LSDs about 2 years into introduction. Now I don't make nearly as much power for most people to justify a LSD, but hey when you go MT you get (helical) LSD with it right? That was how it was for 3G TLs.

Thanks for the links I'll have some fun reading to do.

 

[Rareaccord]

.

Chapter 16 - Problems, Driving Impression, and Future

Problems:
As good as this entire build has turned out, it is not without its problems. There has only been two problems. The first is compressor surges. As stated previously, the car is capped at 8psi. The reason behind such decision was that below about 4500rpm, the compressor surges past 8psi. The cause? the turbo is too small for the car. The small size and the low A/R means quick and low rpm spool, but it also means poor flow on the exhaust side. The solution here is to step up to a bigger turbo.
The second issues is also related to the turbo. Once again, the small size and the low A/R means quick and low rpm spool. This causes a driveability issue where if you suddenly put your foot down instead of rolling onto the throttle quickly, the turbo spools so fast the car goes lean and almost dies. The solution is again to step up to a bigger turbo or use a larger A/R housing on the exhaust side to force the turbo to spool slower.

Driving Impressions (10,000miles):
The improved low end torque really improves the drivability of the car. The car gets up to speed a lot faster, pasting and joining traffic is a lot easier without needing to floor the car. I don't know if other I4 owners feels the same way, but the AC on these cars feels extremely laboring on the engine. The turbo really eliminated this issue for me.

Future:
To resolve the two problems stated above, I've decided to step up to a GT3076r with an internally wastegated exhaust housing. The larger A/R and larger turbine all together should prevent these issues from occurring again. Not to mention the ability to make more power.

The TD04L-14T specs:
0.49 A/R
Compressor wheel: 39.5 / 51 mm
Turbine wheel: 41.3 / 47 mm

The GT3076r specs:
0.82 A/R
Compressor wheel: 57 / 76 mm
Turbine wheel: 55 / 60 mm

To be continued ...

where’d you get the kit from ?

 

[Hudouc]

where’d you get the kit from ?

What kit? There's no kit in this build. I built everything from the ground up myself.

 

[chrisskelly100]

What kit? There's no kit in this build. I built everything from the ground up myself.

Hey! Thanks for your time posting all this info. I'm definitely looking at either turbo or SC on mine. Would it work with the stock exhaust minus the cat? Im not a fan of raspy exhausts. A bolt on supercharger seems allot easier however no turbo noises lol. And I believe the SC is more expensive as well. I can weld myself but not stainless so everything would be just steel. I also have a friend that can do dino tuning so that's helpful.
Did you have any issues with the turbo getting too hot near the hoses and wires on the firewall?
Thanks!!

 

[Hudouc]

Hey! Thanks for your time posting all this info. I'm definitely looking at either turbo or SC on mine. Would it work with the stock exhaust minus the cat? Im not a fan of raspy exhausts. A bolt on supercharger seems allot easier however no turbo noises lol. And I believe the SC is more expensive as well. I can weld myself but not stainless so everything would be just steel. I also have a friend that can do dino tuning so that's helpful.
Did you have any issues with the turbo getting too hot near the hoses and wires on the firewall?
Thanks!!

Depends, if you run a 3" down pipe, you'd have to modify the inlet of the stock exhaust since that inlet is 2.5". If you run 2.5" downpipe, then no modifying is needed. No heat issues here. You can always wrap the exhaust too. I'd recommend stainless steel for just longevity. I used full 304SS for everything, but 312SS is starting to be more commonly available and that has a better heat property than 304SS, making it better for like a down pipe application.

 

[chrisskelly100]

Depends, if you run a 3" down pipe, you'd have to modify the inlet of the stock exhaust since that inlet is 2.5". If you run 2.5" downpipe, then no modifying is needed. No heat issues here. You can always wrap the exhaust too. I'd recommend stainless steel for just longevity. I used full 304SS for everything, but 312SS is starting to be more commonly available and that has a better heat property than 304SS, making it better for like a down pipe application.

I just realized I also own a 2.2l diesel Accord with a turbo that was replaced I actually have the bad turbo so could I rebuild that and use it or do u think it would not be big enough? I haven't actually got the car yet as my country is in lockdown and it's on a separate island 😂

 

[Hudouc]

I just realized I also own a 2.2l diesel Accord with a turbo that was replaced I actually have the bad turbo so could I rebuild that and use it or do u think it would not be big enough? I haven't actually got the car yet as my country is in lockdown and it's on a separate island 😂

It's probably big enough, but a quick search shows that it won't be able to bolt on. It's also a variable geometry turbo that's wastegate less, that's probably not a good idea in a gasoline car.

 

[chrisskelly100]

It's probably big enough, but a quick search shows that it won't be able to bolt on. It's also a variable geometry turbo that's wastegate less, that's probably not a good idea in a gasoline car.

Ah yes of course. Any turbos you recommend? I can probably find plenty on marketplace

 

[Hudouc]

Ah yes of course. Any turbos you recommend? I can probably find plenty on marketplace

I think I did outline some of the pros and cons of different turbos earlier in previous posts.
But I recommend an aftermarket turbo of some sort as opposed to any kind of factory turbo like the TD04 that I initially used simply due to better support. With a true aftermarket turbo, you can configure it in many ways to suit your own needs (driving style, performance characteristic, cost, packaging, etc). It's hard to recommend something without knowing exact what your needs are. You can do some research yourself on how different turbine and compressor size as well as the housing sizes can affect the performance characteristic of the turbo.

 

[chrisskelly100]

Have you got an option on this kit?

For TSX 09-14 For Civic Si 2012-2015 K24Zx K24Z3 K24Z7 Turbo Kit Package 475HP | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for For TSX 09-14 For Civic Si 2012-2015 K24Zx K24Z3 K24Z7 Turbo Kit Package 475HP at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

I'm wanting 250-300whp on stock engine. Will run probably say 8 psi

 

[Hudouc]

Have you got an option on this kit?

For TSX 09-14 For Civic Si 2012-2015 K24Zx K24Z3 K24Z7 Turbo Kit Package 475HP | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for For TSX 09-14 For Civic Si 2012-2015 K24Zx K24Z3 K24Z7 Turbo Kit Package 475HP at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

I'm wanting 250-300whp on stock engine. Will run probably say 8 psi

That's just a generic kit. They don't even include any exhaust piping. The manifold adapter they included is meant for the 9th gen Civic Si, that downward angle wouldn't work on an automatic Accord/TSX with the rear engine mount in the way. Lots of no name components in that kit.

 

[chrisskelly100]

Ok. I have the manual one so it might fit? The seller has said it will fit. I can weld up exhaust piping , but do you think that is an acceptable price?

 

[Hudouc]

Ok. I have the manual one so it might fit? The seller has said it will fit. I can weld up exhaust piping , but do you think that is an acceptable price?

Of course the seller says it will fit. I guess it's worth the money considering that adapter itself is like $400 USD. But I really urge you to put together your own kit and quality components for reliability sake. A used Garrett or Precision turbo in good condition is gonna be miles better than anything eBay has to offer.

 

[Inspire2.4]

@chrisskelly100 bro that kit has a fricking manifold... you are wasting money on some things you will not be able to use becase we(8th gen) don't do manifolds.

 

[chrisskelly100]

@chrisskelly100 bro that kit has a fricking manifold... you are wasting money on some things you will not be able to use becase we(8th gen) don't do manifolds.

Yeah that manifold fits our cars too

Of course the seller says it will fit. I guess it's worth the money considering that adapter itself is like $400 USD. But I really urge you to put together your own kit and quality components for reliability sake. A used Garrett or Precision turbo in good condition is gonna be miles better than anything eBay has to offer.

Ok. Maybe I'll use that kit as a template as you can buy the manifold adapter separate

 

[Hudouc]

Yeah that manifold fits our cars too

He meant the manifold in the top right corner of the first picture.

The second picture is the manifold adapter.

 

[jloc]

What kind of turbo would you recommend going with for drivability? Say I want to add more oomph between 2k-4k RPM.
I'm considering whether or not a turbo build would be even remotely feasible for me. With such wide gearing, the car could certainly use more torque on the low end of the power band. There really should have been another gear between first and second.
The 2.4L has so much more torque than it ever lets on, at least with the A/T. Left in drive, it never enters the power band without straight up flooring the throttle. It would be nice if the RPM range it liked using so much had a usable amount of torque.