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I've read more than one spot where a counter reset happens now on Hondas when you flash. I've read Civic/BMW/Accord/Hyundai threads and articles ad nauseam before my purchase and at the end, it comes down to some simple observations that drove my purchase:

  • After my reading, I believe there is a counter and if you trash the engine or tranny, they can tell if you had a flash if they want to. I have an 84 month bumper to bumper, not worth it. Hell, BMW has figured out how to see a piggyback was used LOL.
  • While tuners are "better", the JB4 is matured for the Honda and there are over 100 users now. I do not intend on racing the car or putting it on the circuit or getting wild with mods, so I do not need an actual tuner to make the power I want. With the touch of a phone screen, I can put it in valet mode (no boost at all), stage 1 +3 psi, or stage 2 +4psi. There are also safety settings, like where you can set it to not add boost until over 20 mph if you have a CVT. This avoids hard take off and wheel spin which is hard on the CVT.
  • Regardless of whether a dealer can easily see a flash or not, I can have the JB4 out of my car in less than 10 mins on the side of the road, and I can change maps instantly on the app with Bluetooth (as stated above). Can also read other OBDII info via phone gauges.
  • I had a piggyback on my 2009 Scion xB for years, because that is all they made, and it produced proven power on a dyno and I had zero issues.
All the pissing contests I have seen are mainly from pro JB4 and pro Hondata/Ktuner websites, it is the normal forum posturing when brands compete. One of the JB4 bad mouth posts out there is actually from someone who sells the other stuff LOL. They went through the same negative press when getting into the BMW work, now they do a lot of brands. The funniest to me is people running higher stages on a Ktuner and Hondata act like a piggy back is bad for you car. Well, duh, so is running the higher power numbers with the other two. The whole thing is a little ridiculous.

End of the day, what do you expect Hondata and Ktuner to say other than "it won't void your warranty", or "Honda cannot tell you flashed", or the best, the tourettes forum answer of "magnuson moss warranty act". Hondata won't be in court with you, neither will Ktuner or JB4. There are general user posts on the net that there is a counter that resets, some seem to be from folks who work for Honda in some capacity. So it goes as, you trash your transmission, reflash, it goes in, and if they check, they will see the counter at a low number and they can prove it was recently flashed. I'm not willing to take that chance, because good luck proving I had a JB4. I'm also not a fan of the inconvenience of the flash process I have watched on numerous youtube videos. Real nice if you break down in BFE and want to reflash before you go into the dealer. And lets not even get into the folks that mount the Ktuner screen in the car, I mean how are you gonna hide that? I also know plenty of folks that mod their vehicles with no regard for the warranty, that is fine too. YMMV.

I also do not want this thread to turn into a JB4 vs the other two, no need for that. I'll post impressions, and when I get some time, I intend on running Map 0, 1 and 2 on a dyno since I already run 93 octane, and Ill try some logging in the next week.

Just 1.5 cents from someone who just bought their first Honda, and did a lot of reading with no dog in the hunt other than a vehicle warranty. As far as current JB4 Map 1 and 2 logs on the Hondas, they look fine in the N54 forum thread for the cars. The only ones I have found that are wonky are user-related once you read the comments.

There is a VW post where they went to the dealer with the JB4 installed and the dealer made a note on their account, can't fix stupid. It also seems they are still evaluating some Audi models. What I like is they will tell you to log map 0 and 1, send in the logs, before doing anything else. They are branching out and learning new brands, but also aren't hiding it from their users.
 

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I'm also not a fan of the inconvenience of the flash process I have watched on numerous youtube videos. Real nice if you break down in BFE and want to reflash before you go into the dealer.
Playing devil's advocate here, in your signature you have a PRL intake. Do you carry the stock intake in your trunk in case you break down in BFE?
 

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Playing devil's advocate here, in your signature you have a PRL intake. Do you carry the stock intake in your trunk in case you break down in BFE?
Not sure how I can address that, to be honest. Apples to oranges IMO. Shred a transmission in BFE, no one cares about an intake, I know from experience. Shred a tranny in BFE, you don't want the tune in there, or for them to see it was flashed like right after the tranny trashed.

And to be honest, I keep all the parts. Another example, Wife was driving my car (CAI) YEARS back and hydrolocked it during a bad storm. I changed the intake before getting the tow truck... There isn't an intake counter in the car, there is a tune counter IMO.

All that being said, my JB4 vs other tuner debate ends. I'm just going to post impressions of the JB4.


On a more relevant point, I got the app installed, the JB4 is at home, going to head home shortly and make some runs on Map 1 to share with BMS. I set the low-speed boost limit at 2 psi (their recommend from the CVT Civic test car they have) to protect the CVT a little more.
 

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Install wasn't too bad. Had to use the BT video on how to install the BT adapter into the JB4, and then use images on the thread at N54 that shows Honda Accord MAP and TMAP pics. Not too happy with my wire routing since I didn't have electrical tape, so Ill will tidy it up this weekend. Made a good pull in Map 1 and posted the CSV and chart on N54 for them to review. FW update was pretty easy, just run it from the app while in the car and connected to the JB4, with the car in accessory mode. When you sit in the car, turn it on, open the app, and hit connect, it connects quickly, and seems to work very well from the app. I can leave the app all the time so I can see the temps, but I cannot go to the Car Play Now Playing screen, but audio still plays from music on my phone and the steering wheel audio controls work fine while the app is up.

Map 1 charted from CSV.

 

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Ok, so hitting the audio button to the right of the car screen gives me the other audio screen with cover art, and that stays up fine with the app running.

Oil temp readings are not working correctly yet, so I am going to swap that gauge out with something else. I do like having Water Temp and IAT showing on my phone screen. Once I get comfortable with everything and check more logs, I'll probably run Map 2 all the time.

Here are the details for install, and with the current FW updates:

Order Here: Honda 1.5L Turbo JB4 | Burger Motorsports

Install Guide: http://www.burgertuning.com/instruct...bo_install.pdf

We picked up a tenth gen 2018 Civic Sport CVT 1.5L turbo for product development. Immediate development includes a JB4 Honda Turbo tuning system, BMS Performance Intake, & Pedal Tuner module.

Honda Map Guide as of v2 firmware:

Map 0: Disables JB4 all together
Map 1: +3.5 psi, default map. Suggested for 91+ octane.
Map 2: +4.0 psi, Suggested for 91-93 octane
Map 3: +4.5 psi, Suggested for 93+ octane
Map 4: +5.0 psi, Suggested for 30% E85
Map 5: +6.0 psi (30% E85 or race gas, alpha testing, seems OK so far)
Map 6: User Adjustable Custom Tuning Map
Map 7: +9.0 psi (30% E85 or race gas, alpha testing, use at your own risk!)
Map 8: VALET/Low Boost Map

FUD Bit Settings as of v4:

FutureUseD on User Adjustment Page:
bit0 -
bit1 -
bit2 - Turn on to disable JB4 hot/cold water & oil temperature protection
bit3 -
bit4 -
bit5 - Turn on to disable over boost and run lean safety systems
bit6 - Turn on if vehicle has an aftermarket flash map loaded to the ECU
bit7 - Turn on to enable more aggressive gas pedal based boost mapping


Firmware:

Note TypeR requires special firmware with "TYPER" in the firmware name and has a revised map guide. Currently only map1 and map2 is enabled for the TYPER firmware.

JB4_HONDA_5:

1) Setup firmware split for TypeR from normal Civic models. TypeR now has dedicated firmware with "TYPER" in it's name.
2) Adjustments to top end taper on all maps, determined it's best to taper boost down over 6000 rpm. CVTs shift better this way, and manuals normally shift by 6000 rpm on their own.
3) Setup map7 as full "send it" map. Not sure how safe it's going to be so use with extreme caution.

JB4_HONDA_4:

1) Enabled FutureUseD adjustment options outlined above.
2) Adjusted interface boost scaling, after updating firmware disconnect and reconnect to reset interface scaling.
3) Added in over boost and run lean safety systems. If boost exceeds the user defined "boost safety" setting for more than 1 second the JB4 will revert to map0. Similarly if AFR goes leaner than 14:1 at full throttle for more than one second the JB4 will revert to map0. These safety system can be disabled in the FutureUseD bit5 if needed for diagnostic purposes.
4) Relocated "knock control" under IGN-2 and adjusted "TimingAVG" to reflect a new 0-10 metric for knock control. It's scaled such that 0 = 0.50 10 = 1.20 which I think is more intuitive. We'll keep an eye on it and users can continue to reference whichever scaling they prefer.
5) Various minor logging parameter fixes.
6) Adjusted pedal to boost mapping to be more conservative/smoother. The previous more aggressive mapping can be enabled under FUD.7.
7) Enabled hot/cold protection. Boost will remain at stock levels until water temp is > 160f degrees and if water temp goes above 250f degrees boost will decay down to stock levels. Can be disabled under the FUD.2 bit.


JB4_HONDA_3:

1) Changed how RPM & Pedal input are logged on the back end. Should be seamless to users.
2) Added WGDC logging parameter
3) Added long term fuel trims under fuel_trims2, using same scaling as fuel_trims. 25 = 0%, 50 = +33%.
4) Programmed a mystery temp parameter under OilTemp. I think it represents temperature of air coming off the radiator. Not sure yet. Will keep an eye on it. Still don't have the actual oil temp logging parameter yet.

JB4_HONDA_2:

1) Enabled additional CANbus channels including air/fuel ratio, fuel trims (scaled 25 = 0, 0 = 34%, 50 = + 34%), ignition advance, IAT (charge air intake temps), high fuel pressure, and more!
2) Revised maps to reduce top end boost taper.
3) Enabled additional higher boost maps for testing purposes only, ideally for those on high quality fuel (e.g. E85 mixtures or octane booster) to start. Later when we've collected more data we'll open up these maps for pump grade fuels.

JB4_HONDA_1:

1) Enabled CANbus with basic information for engine speed, vehicle speed (to allow boost by speed settings), water temperature, and pedal input. More coming! To activate just update firmware and attach the included OBDII cable to the JB4 harness. Install photos for OBDII coming soon.
1C) Adjusted boost scaling/zero point for more accurate boost display.

JB4 Mobile Smart Phone wireless connection directions Click here
BMS data cable hard wired directions&software Click here
 

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OK, so Map 2 charts looked OK, I sent them in to BM. When I sat down with map 1 and map 2 csv's printed, there is not a lot of difference, so I will settle on Map 2.

I set my Boost Limit Safety at 23.0, it already won't add boost now until the engine warms up (160 degrees; newer FW feature), and I have max added boost from low speed or standstill at 3.0psi. Car is very fun, and in Sport Mode it is REALLY fun. I actually find less of a need for Sport now to be honest, with Map 2.

Another thing of note, on my Map 2 run, 2000 rpm - 5800, 22 mph - 77, knock was .50 and .49 the whole way. If I understand correctly, .49 is basically "0". They have one gauge on the app that shows .49 to 1.2, or "0-100", and then another version that literally shows 0-100 for knock control. These and other parts of the logs give some interesting data to look at.
 

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Finding I don’t really use sport mode anymore. Power is there with Map 2 so fuel mileage is improving not using sport. Going to get my hands on a Dragy and see how the maps compare.
 

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Finding I don’t really use sport mode anymore. Power is there with Map 2 so fuel mileage is improving not using sport. Going to get my hands on a Dragy and see how the maps compare.
Any general updates?
 

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Nothing substantial, which is a good thing. It runs Map 2 on 93 octane with no knock control under load. I think if you go to Map 3 it may push a little knock control on 93, but I have not felt the need. The power is fun, and in sport mode, it is REALLY fun in 30-60mph traffic. Since I don't drag race or brake boost, I removed the 3 psi reduction from 0-42 mph, this is only an issue if you get on it in the rain and it will spin the tires lol. On the interstate, if you decide to jump around someone when they won't get over, you have to pay attention to pedal usage and top speed lol.

I did buy a draggy to test 0-60's on Maps 0-2, but haven't had a chance yet. Next is Thermal exhaust and probably a PRL intercooler. I think once the intercooler is installed (same trip), I may let the local guys that do the install on the IC go ahead with a Hondata dyno tune at that point. Not sure. Burger Moto is supposed to be coming out with something along the lines of an IC in 2-3 months, so I am curious.

I am running
Map 2
93 Octane
23.0 Boost Safety
Will not add any power until engine hits 160 F
 

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Any general updates?
Map 3 actually feels smoother in power delivery, it's hard to explain but I have been running it a week. I see no evidence of additional knock control either over map 2. Knock control will rise a little on the highway on cruise, other than that it is quiet. This thing will flat out go.
 

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I think once the intercooler is installed (same trip), I may let the local guys that do the install on the IC go ahead with a Hondata dyno tune at that point. Not sure. Burger Moto is supposed to be coming out with something along the lines of an IC in 2-3 months, so I am curious.
Wait so won't getting a Hondata direct tune from a tuner dealer reset the flash counter too? Or does that not apply?

Just thought I'd ask because you're going through all this effort to be able to cover your tracks
 

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Yes, and I changed my mind and just went with the tuner knowing they can tell that I have done it. Its a gamble, but I dont care.

If you want to hide, the JB4 is a nice options.
 

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Yes, and I changed my mind and just went with the tuner knowing they can tell that I have done it. Its a gamble, but I dont care.

If you want to hide, the JB4 is a nice options.
Out of curiosity, what changed your mind to nix the JB4? Were you having issues with it? I'm considering one since I'm not looking to wholly void my warranty but there just isn't enough information available online from people who've used these for several months.
 

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Nothing, I just wanted the better display setup, plus if I get that far there are local tuners here who can dyno tune Hondata or Ktuner. The Ktuner power delivery feels a little more smooth, but the JB4 was fun when I had it.
 

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I don’t quite understand why somebody that is performance oriented would do a piggyback over a well-crafted tune like Ktuner or Hondata. With the exception of somebody having an 84 month warranty because that would be silly to add anything on your car. But for the average person with a 36 month warranty Spend your money wisely and for $400 get the Ktuner and enjoy how the car feels. Just don’t be stupid and do a bunch of burnouts and hard launchers and you’ll be perfectly fine. If you planned on doing burnouts and hard launches you should not of bought the 1.5 L CVT accord. But for the average person that wants more power for passing and accelerating the key to enter stage to map is marvelous. It just takes a little common knowledge to ensure the CVT doesn’t have any problems .
 
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