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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I recently purchased a 2016 Accord LX. There were 11 miles on the odo at delivery, the car was originally inspected by the dealership in April 2016, and had been in the showroom for a while.

1. Is there any reason to change the oil right away, given that it's been sitting for over a year? I see no indication on the post-purchase paperwork that would indicate that any fluids have been changed, and the Maintenance Minder system still shows oil at 100%. I trust the MM system, but it's not omniscient for all situations. I definitely want the engine to have maximum lifetime, and don't want to screw up the break in period.

2. I would like to do at least the oil changes and tire rotations myself (A 1 Maintenance Minder items). Am I correct in understanding that the MM system should only be "reset" once all items have been performed for a specific group of services? For example, if there is A(oil) and 1(rotate tires), and I just rotate tires + reset the system, then it will just assume that I've done the oil change (ie there's no chemical detection system that says the oil should be changed). This is particularly relevant because I'd like to rotate ever 5,000, not 7,500 miles, to extend life of tires.

3. Is there a way to see what index from the MM is up next? or to toggle through the MM system to tell the car "hey we're actually at a different interval now"?
For example, let's say that the order is 1) A1 at 7500, 2) B2 at 15000 , 3) A1 at 22500, 4) ... (just making up those data)
And I or someone else accidentally skips over #2, can I access that the car mistakenly has A1 cued up, and can I change it to index back to #2 B2?

4. I have snow tires (195 Nokians) from another vehicle, used just 1.5 months. The OM says that 205's should be used, but most people I know also put narrower snow tires. a) is it actually ill advised to use narrower tires? of course, I'd mount new wheels to fit the Accord appropriately. b) as long as the tread wear is even--I haven't actually checked this--, is it okay to use tires used by another vehicle? It was an AWD 3 series BMW, if that makes any difference in tread wear opinions.

I know there are lots of questions here. Thanks for any advice you could provide!
 

· V6 6MT CBP
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1. http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/8...s-15%-5%-1-year-follow-sticker-when-help.html

2. Just ignore the MM tire code if you go less than the MM.

3. The MM will pop codes based on the miles and type of driving you do. If you READ YOUR MANUAL that came with your car, it should tell you all the services and their "normal' intervals.

4. If a tire fits a wheel for your car, it does not matter if it was on another vehicle. Skinny tires are generally better for winter, but 205 is not going to handle as well - its a trade off.
 

· BRWNFLSH now
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I also plan to rotate the tires every 5000 miles, so I will ignore the maintenance minder for that particular code. I am keeping track of the rotations in the blank pages at the back of the owner's manual, just so I remember exactly when the rotation was done. No, there is no oil monitor. The maintenance minder does not know the oil quality or even the oil level, so check your oil using the dipstick often, at least until you determine the rate of consumption (if any). When you reset the maintenance minder, it assumes you did all the maintenance required for the codes. Some people say the dealership can reset particular codes, but I don't know if that is true or not.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
1. http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/8...s-15%-5%-1-year-follow-sticker-when-help.html

2. Just ignore the MM tire code if you go less than the MM.

3. The MM will pop codes based on the miles and type of driving you do. If you READ YOUR MANUAL that came with your car, it should tell you all the services and their "normal' intervals.

4. If a tire fits a wheel for your car, it does not matter if it was on another vehicle. Skinny tires are generally better for winter, but 205 is not going to handle as well - its a trade off.
I appreciate your response.

All of my questions were prompted by reading the manual thoroughly. The thread about oil, unfortunately, isn't fully consistent with the manual, which says nothing about oil life in terms of chronological time. It's not apparent whether chronological time was built into the algorithm. The manual also says nothing about recommended service intervals in terms of mileage, other than to follow the MM system prompts. Hence my question about how to correct it if someone screws it up and the other question about oil life if the car has just been sitting there for a long time.

I'll email the utterly unhelpful dealership, and hopefully get answers to my questions.

Edit--
Until I hear otherwise, I'll just follow the MM system strictly.
 

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Any questions are always welcome here.

I'm not sure if these cars come with a "break-in" oil straight from the factory. Some say yes, most say no. In the manual it does say to have the oil changed at least once a year regardless of how many miles are driven. Since the car has been sitting around for more than a year, it would be a good idea to change the oil but DO NOT reset the MM since the car has very low miles on the odometer. This is what I would do. If you decide not to change out the original oil, then once it gets to 15%, that would be the best time to change it since that oil has been in the engine for a year or more. Again, not sure if car comes with break-in oil or not. I researched on the internet with no definative answer. Good idea to call dealership's service dept and ask.

When it comes to tire rotation, I would recommend changing them at 7,500 mile intervals since you will be using winter tires for a few months of the year. I have a 2016 sport and try to save on tire wear by making slow, wide turns whenever possible. Most tire wear occurs while making turns and the car leans to one side. 4 new tires for the sport cost $1,000+ and the conti pro contact it came with only come with a 55,000 tread life compared to tires on other accord trims which come with I think 70,000 or 80,000 mile tread life warranty.
 

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Ordinarily I would say to either follow the MM or change oil once every year if a low mileage driver. Oil, even pure synthetic, still oxidizes over time like any petroleum does. And a car driven lightly may accumulate condensation in the oil over a year if it’s not driven enough to boil off the internal condensation.

But, your car hasn’t been driven really at all, and if it was inside for much of that, then condensation and such should not be an issue. So I’d think you should be fine to just drive and follow the MM for the first oil change.

And yes, resetting the MM resets all codes as it assumes whatever codes had been showing were dealt with.

#3. I don’t know if that is possible.

#4. Thankfully I’ve not had to use snow tires anymore since the 1990s. :grin
 

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As most owners don't know when their car was manufactured, Honda's requirement to change the oil at least once per year starts on the delivery date. But it does create an interesting dilemma.

Honda doesn't use a special break-in oil, but its assembly lubes are full of molybdenum, which washes into the oil and essentially becomes a mix Honda believes is good for an effective engine break-in.

During break-in, the piston rings and cylinder walls have to wear slightly to conform to one another and create a good seal. This process can create hot spots on cyclinder walls, especially if too much throttle is used for too long. These hot spots can leave deposits that compromise the seal, contribute to oil consumption, fuel dilution and other bad behavior and can only be removed if the engine is disassembled.

Honda seems to believe the molybdenum in the factory fill helps to prevent these hot spots from occurring, thus its recommendation to not change the oil until the Maintenance Minder tells you to do so.

So on one hand, you have 1 year-old plus oil in the crankcase that may have deteriorated with time. On the other hand, you have Honda's recommendation to not change the oil early.

I have a similar situation with an Acura I just bought that had been on the lot for 6 months. My plan is to run the factory fill for 3 or 4 thousand miles and then replace it with Mazda 0w-20 for another 4 or 5 thousand. Why Mazda? Because it's the only readily available oil that contains a bunch of molybdenum (comparing used oil analyses for Honda factory fills and Mazda 0w-20 shows both contain about 500 ppm of molybdenum). By doing this I think I'll be getting rid of oil that may have been compromised a bit by time but replacing it with oil that staisfies Honda's molybdenum jones. After one run of Mazda 0w-20 (it's not cheap) I'll go to whatever I plan to use long-term.

Just my two cents.
 

· V6 6MT CBP
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I bought my car that had been sitting on the lot for 10+ months, it had 62 test drive miles on it. Bought August 6th 2015.

I did not do my first oil change until the MM went to 0% at 9,992 miles February 1, 2016. How long had the oil been sitting in there? Who knows, who cares. Car runs perfectly fine, and uses virtually no oil as I approach my 4th oil change at 40k.

There is no need to over think it. Drive it until it tells you to change it.
 

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I bought my car that had been sitting on the lot for 10+ months, it had 62 test drive miles on it. Bought August 6th 2015.

I did not do my first oil change until the MM went to 0% at 9,992 miles February 1, 2016. How long had the oil been sitting in there? Who knows, who cares. Car runs perfectly fine, and uses virtually no oil as I approach my 4th oil change at 40k.

There is no need to over think it. Drive it until it tells you to change it.
What's the fun in that?
 

· HondaNewb
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I bought my car that had been sitting on the lot for 10+ months, it had 62 test drive miles on it. Bought August 6th 2015.

I did not do my first oil change until the MM went to 0% at 9,992 miles February 1, 2016. How long had the oil been sitting in there? Who knows, who cares. Car runs perfectly fine, and uses virtually no oil as I approach my 4th oil change at 40k.

There is no need to over think it. Drive it until it tells you to change it.
I agree 100% with you. Drive more, worry less.

I do my oil when MM tells me too. Not my father in law, not my dealership, and not my cousin Vinny.
 

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As most owners don't know when their car was manufactured, Honda's requirement to change the oil at least once per year starts on the delivery date. But it does create an interesting dilemma.
:confused: You mean most people don’t realize it’s printed right there on the driver’s door frame (month and year of manufacture) on every car :laugh

People should read those little stickers on the doors - some useful info there.
 

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Always a good debate on this subject.

I have a theory on why they seem to extend the oil change intervals. Because cars were lasting too long. How is that bad? 100K miles is expected, but cars should not run 200K or 300K miles. Manufactures "don't" want you to drive cars that old. Not only will you not buy another product $$$$, an old car is likely to give a bad impression about the brand. If your 200K Honda breaks down, and get you into an accident, you will never buy a Honda again. Honda sucks. If your 150K Honda develops a problem, it's time to sell or trade in for......another new Honda. Hondas are great. I change it 4K+. No more than 5K. Your car. Your money. Either case, you should be good to go no matter what. How long do you plan to keep it? Most of us will starting thinking about a new car once over 100K, right? Some of us, before that.
 

· HondaNewb
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Always a good debate on this subject.

I have a theory on why they seem to extend the oil change intervals. Because cars were lasting too long. How is that bad? 100K miles is expected, but cars should not run 200K or 300K miles.
Shoot, I came from a Volkswagen TDI (Diesel), they had 10,000 mile intervals and practically took 100,000 miles just to break in. 250,000 is a piece of cake for these cars. Heck, most TDI owners get 175,000+ miles out a set of brake pads.
 

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I have a theory on why they seem to extend the oil change intervals. Because cars were lasting too long.
The theory you have has a name: conspiracy theory.

One problem with your theory is: I cannot count the number of Honda, Toyota, and even GM and Ford vehicles that friends and family have, and all made it well above 200,000 miles with no significant problems. Look on non-brand-specific sites regarding repairs and mileage, and you'll find that MANY vehicle engines go well beyond 200,000 miles. It's automatic transmissions that seem to be the weak link these days.
 

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Not to mention the main reasons cars are lasting so long now is precisely because of design, material and manufacturing developments pioneered by the auto makers themselves.

In the past, high mileage engines were also not necessarily rare. Cars and pickups mainly were replaced due to rust - in other words, it was the chassis and body that wore out, not the engine (if properly maintained). My father in the 1960s, 70’s, 80’s and 90’s routinely piled up 100k to 200k miles per car. The engines were still running well when we’d get rid of them, but they were total rust buckets by then (and that was with regular oil spray undercoating and such things to try and keep the rust in check).
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
As most owners don't know when their car was manufactured, Honda's requirement to change the oil at least once per year starts on the delivery date. But it does create an interesting dilemma.

Honda doesn't use a special break-in oil, but its assembly lubes are full of molybdenum, which washes into the oil and essentially becomes a mix Honda believes is good for an effective engine break-in.

During break-in, the piston rings and cylinder walls have to wear slightly to conform to one another and create a good seal. This process can create hot spots on cyclinder walls, especially if too much throttle is used for too long. These hot spots can leave deposits that compromise the seal, contribute to oil consumption, fuel dilution and other bad behavior and can only be removed if the engine is disassembled.

Honda seems to believe the molybdenum in the factory fill helps to prevent these hot spots from occurring, thus its recommendation to not change the oil until the Maintenance Minder tells you to do so.

So on one hand, you have 1 year-old plus oil in the crankcase that may have deteriorated with time. On the other hand, you have Honda's recommendation to not change the oil early.

I have a similar situation with an Acura I just bought that had been on the lot for 6 months. My plan is to run the factory fill for 3 or 4 thousand miles and then replace it with Mazda 0w-20 for another 4 or 5 thousand. Why Mazda? Because it's the only readily available oil that contains a bunch of molybdenum (comparing used oil analyses for Honda factory fills and Mazda 0w-20 shows both contain about 500 ppm of molybdenum). By doing this I think I'll be getting rid of oil that may have been compromised a bit by time but replacing it with oil that staisfies Honda's molybdenum jones. After one run of Mazda 0w-20 (it's not cheap) I'll go to whatever I plan to use long-term.

Just my two cents.
Great information. Thank you.


As an update, I spoke with the dealership, who said the following:

"The recommendation is against "in-use" vehicle. Your Accord is brand-new vehicle and the oil is not used at all. This recommendation starts once you started driving. I understand your concern but the motor oil is 100% artificial and is not changed by time (no expiration day) but usage. You can drive safely for several thousand miles with current engine oil. "

I still have concerns about the fact that it was driven 11 miles, then sat for so long. However, the general recommendation is that because the current oil really hasn't been "used" in the traditional sense of being driven hear and there for over a year, and since it hasn't been exposed to outdoor conditions, it should be fine.

That's great information about the molybdenum, and good idea on the Mazda oil. I'll consider doing the same as you.
 

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I wouldn't lose much sleep over it. We're on an annual oci due to low miles. First oil change was with the mazda 0w20. Next oil change was with pennzoil platinum 0w20, on sale at most wally worlds for under $15 when you figure in the $10 rebate.

Car sitting on the lot for 6 months should not have deteriorated the fluids any. If anything there's probably a higher moisture content which should burn off after some extended operating temperature driving.
 
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