Drive Accord Honda Forums banner

1 - 20 of 61 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
151 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Several websites have the Sport MT with a 0-60 around 6.6, and the EX CVT at 7.6. What makes up the biggest part of the difference? Is it mostly the CVT vs MT, or is it the dual exhaust, a different tune, suspension, etc?

I have a 2013 EX-L sedan and would like to add some performance. What could I do?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
114 Posts
the transmission is the difference in 0-60 times and the specs are only a few HP more in the sport.... my coupe EX with the 6MT is faster then the 7CVT, ive drove both back to back and there is a difference in my opinion

heres the break down courteous of "namegoeshere"

LX, EX, EX-L, EX-L Navi
2.4L (2356 cc) inline 4, 16-Valve DOHC i-VTEC, Direct Injection
185 hp @ 6400 rpm
181 lb-ft @ 3900 rpm
Redline - 6800 rpm
Compression Ratio - 11.1:1

Sport
2.4L (2354 cc) inline 4, 16-Valve DOHC i-VTEC, Direct Injection
189 hp @ 6400 rpm
182 lb-ft @ 3900 rpm
Redline - 6800 rpm
Compression Ratio - 11.1:1

EX-L V6, EX-L V6 Navi, Touring V6
3.5L (3471 cc) V6, 24-Valve SOHC i-VTEC, Multi-Point Fuel Injection
278 hp @ 6200 rpm
252 hp @ 4900 rpm
Redline - 6800 rpm
Compression Ratio - 10.5:1
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
884 Posts
The cvt is the problem. Hp and tq numbers are nearly the same.

Beat me to it. :(
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
151 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the info! Is there a tuner or somthing I can use to modify the CVT or performance in general? Would a CAI or exhaust make any difference if you don't modify the CVT?
 

·
2013 Accord Sport 6SPD
Joined
·
4 Posts
CVT transmissions are meant for fuel economy not performance. The CVT technology is still fairly new. It only has one gear. The jump start on a CVT transmission is pretty slow. Keep in mind the 0-60 is a very subjective topic for any car. Honda's test was probably done with the perfect weather condition, professional driver who is light in weight, and the car probably has low fuel, hence lighter weight in the car and faster times.
 

·
Even My Mower Is a Honda!
Joined
·
4,339 Posts
CVT transmissions are meant for fuel economy not performance. The CVT technology is still fairly new. It only has one gear. The jump start on a CVT transmission is pretty slow. Keep in mind the 0-60 is a very subjective topic for any car. Honda's test was probably done with the perfect weather condition, professional driver who is light in weight, and the car probably has low fuel, hence lighter weight in the car and faster times.
His numbers come from Car and Driver and Motor Trend.

Jay
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
114 Posts
Thanks for the info! Is there a tuner or somthing I can use to modify the CVT or performance in general? Would a CAI or exhaust make any difference if you don't modify the CVT?
mods will liven the car up a bit but the price over gains is up to you, and mods will void warranties depending on what you do :nuts: as far as tuning goes, Hondata or another tuning company may bring out a tune for our cars but DO NOT go and buy an ebay tune or any other tune that offers huge gains because they are mostly fake! ATM i dont know of any tunes for our cars :thumbsdow
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,223 Posts
CVT transmissions are meant for fuel economy not performance. The CVT technology is still fairly new. It only has one gear. The jump start on a CVT transmission is pretty slow. Keep in mind the 0-60 is a very subjective topic for any car. Honda's test was probably done with the perfect weather condition, professional driver who is light in weight, and the car probably has low fuel, hence lighter weight in the car and faster times.
I disagree with your assumption about the CVT. Every car I have ever read about has a slower zero to sixty time with an automatic transmission compared to a standard transmission with one exception, the Porsche tiptronic. Automatic transmissions in mid price range cars all have a certain amount of power loss due to the complexity of an automatic. The CVT is just a different way to get an infinite number of gear ratios not just one gear ratio as you suggest. The CVT allows the engine to use the optimum RPM to get the best torque for every driving situation including better milage. CVT transmissions are not a new technology and have been used in Honda automobiles since 2000. They have been used in other applications even longer. I think that the future of automatics is the CVT because Honda has built a CVT transmission factory in Ohio and is building one in Mexico next to it's new assembly plant. Between emission standards and fuel economy requirements globally the standard transmission may become a relic.

The Porsche dual clutch tiptonic automatic transmission actually can beat the zero to sixty times of the standard transmission Porsche. Of course, the cost of those cars is about twice the cost of a top of the line Accord and it's not a CVT transmission.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
151 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Dang, I did not mean to start a war, lols.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
296 Posts
I disagree with your assumption about the CVT. Every car I have ever read about has a slower zero to sixty time with an automatic transmission compared to a standard transmission with one exception, the Porsche tiptronic. Automatic transmissions in mid price range cars all have a certain amount of power loss due to the complexity of an automatic.
There's a lot more than Porsches... Manuals being faster are largely a thing of the past for most performance/sports/super cars. And every drivetrain suffers from power loss, though automatics are historically higher than MT's. CVT's are usually in place to maximize efficiency, but i believe they can be set up to maximize performance as some bikes have them. the accord's cvt is i'm sure focused on efficiency, but geared enough to performance to not ruin the experience.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
916 Posts
There's a lot more than Porsches... Manuals being faster are largely a thing of the past for most performance/sports/super cars. And every drivetrain suffers from power loss, though automatics are historically higher than MT's. CVT's are usually in place to maximize efficiency, but i believe they can be set up to maximize performance as some bikes have them. the accord's cvt is i'm sure focused on efficiency, but geared enough to performance to not ruin the experience.
No cars in the Accords league are faster with any kind of automatic. Some extremely powerful cars with launch control are faster with automatics - mostly because of wheelspin.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
296 Posts
No cars in the Accords league are faster with any kind of automatic. Some extremely powerful cars with launch control are faster with automatics - mostly because of wheelspin.
VW's equipped with DSG trannies are faster than their manual counterparts. the "extremely powerful cars" you speak of aren't faster because of wheelspin, they are faster because they can not only shift gears perfectly every single time, but in a fraction of the time any mortal* could possible achieve.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
235 Posts
Will a tune really do much? I thought only turbocharged cars had significant performance gains with a tune.

If tune costs $500+, probably not worth it imo. Guess we'll see if/when someone develops.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
916 Posts
VW's equipped with DSG trannies are faster than their manual counterparts. the "extremely powerful cars" you speak of aren't faster because of wheelspin, they are faster because they can not only shift gears perfectly every single time, but in a fraction of the time any mortal* could possible achieve.
No they are not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,223 Posts
Dang, I did not mean to start a war, lols.
Don't worry, you didn't start a war. I have been extremely happy with the CVT transmission in my car. There are some people on this forum who have had terrible problems with their CVT equipped cars and Honda has replaced a couple of them with new units. However, there is a lot of misconception and misunderstanding about the CVT transmission because the transmission is new to the Accord. Of course Honda went with this technology to increase fuel economy and did a marvelous job when mated to the I4 Earth Dreams engine. Additionally, the transmission operates almost seamlessly and can deliver torque almost instantly when you step on the accelerator. Combined with the paddle shifters the car can be driven very aggressively. There is also a very vocal group of members who love their manual transmissions and I can understand their loyalty. I drove only manuals including an Accord and a Prelude until 1998. Honda is one of the few companies that offers a manual transmission in their flagship sedan.

I think for everyday commuting in traffic having to shift gears is a chore I don't enjoy any longer and I find the CVT to be the best choice for me. I love owning a sporty looking coupe since there are less and less mid size two door cars being offered. Both the coupe and the manual transmission may become extinct in mid size family type cars in the future.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,775 Posts
CVTs like traditional automatic transmissions have torque converters which uses fluid to transfer energy/lock up which isn't the best medium for transferring mechanical energy. The amount of lock up depends on many factors and isn't always at 100% lock up. Therefore you are not always getting the most power out of the engine as possible. More power is loss from the engine to the wheels because of this transmission design as opposed to an automatic dual clutch transmission or a manual transmission.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
296 Posts
No they are not.
mmk what is it with this forum that makes people so argumentative? no what are not what? conventional torque converter automatics are slower, aside from some specific applications. dual-clutch transmissions are faster. the cvt in the accord uses a torque converter. this is a pretty basic explanation for why the accord auto produces slower acceleration times.

edit: on2 beeat me to it. there are cvt's without a torque converter or clutch, but i'm not very familiar with setup/application.

Will a tune really do much? I thought only turbocharged cars had significant performance gains with a tune.

If tune costs $500+, probably not worth it imo. Guess we'll see if/when someone develops.
if the car is stock, there's nothing to really tune. once a few bolt-ons have been added, a tune could arguably maximize the potential gains from those upgrades and be worth the money spent; however, not so sure there is a way to tune the 9th gen just yet.. ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
916 Posts
VW's are absolutely not faster with the dct. The dct may shift a bit faster, but it is a moot point when you can shift fast enough manually.

So yes the DCT shifts faster, but no it does not accelerate faster and on top of that it uses more gas. Keep in mind shifting speed is not the only factor. For one thing the DCT weighs 50 lbs more, and it also has more parasitic loss. The energy to shift is not free it has to come from somewhere and that somewhere is the engine.

Here are numbers from Consumer Reports - they test every car the same way and they don't drop the clutch (may actually hurt the stick).

Jetta/Golf TDI

0-30 3.6 dct 3.2 stick
0-60 9.5 dct 9.4 stick
45-65 6.0 dct 5.2 stick
1/4 m 17.3 dct 17.1 stick

Stick is faster at every point. Theory is theory - real world numbers are what maters. BTW the stick also gets better mpg.

34 mpg overall for dct and 38 overall for stick.

Is the Porsche faster with it's tiptronic (pdk) - it is on the track. Although I understand that it is only faster if you put it in launch control mode which takes a couple of seconds, so is it really faster in day to day driving? Not so sure. And how much is that transmission over the cost of a manual - $4,000. This on top of an $85,000 911. For $4,000 it better be faster.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
884 Posts
VW's equipped with DSG trannies are faster than their manual counterparts. the "extremely powerful cars" you speak of aren't faster because of wheelspin, they are faster because they can not only shift gears perfectly every single time, but in a fraction of the time any mortal* could possible achieve.
No they are not.
Really? The DSG can change gear in .2 seconds



http://youtu.be/X4HpD5K6Qws
 
1 - 20 of 61 Posts
Top