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2010 2.4EX
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112 Posts
Or maybe it's vice versa? Is VSA alerting because the
steering angle isn't correct so VSA is disengaged/disabled?

Just another W.A.G...
Possible! But once krisdev gets his VSA sorted out, he should also have the Steering Angle reset, as it should have been done at his last alignment. Any shop worth their salt should know this already.

Now I'm curious: Is it possible for some cars with conventional(hydraulic pump) power steering to possess an angle sensor?...hmmm
 

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Discussion Starter #42
@Miker and @The_K_Man , it is not pulling to the left. The steering wheel wants to spin to the left. It doesn't matter if the car is moving or not or if the wheels are on or off the ground.

The electric power steering motor is literally turning the wheel to the left for the first 30 minutes of driving. If you do not hold the steering wheel, it will turn into oncoming traffic. I'm not talking about pulling or drifting to the left. This is a motor turning the wheel forcefully.

After 30 minutes of driving it goes away.

It's also not so much about complexity, but getting the right tools or information to understand what is happening. Like the right type of OBD2 reader and diagnostic tool. Most of the battle is the diagnosis and find the tools.
 

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2010 2.4EX
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@Miker and @The_K_Man , it is not pulling to the left. The steering wheel wants to spin to the left. It doesn't matter if the car is moving or not or if the wheels are on or off the ground.

The electric power steering motor is literally turning the wheel to the left for the first 30 minutes of driving. If you do not hold the steering wheel, it will turn into oncoming traffic. I'm not talking about pulling or drifting to the left. This is a motor turning the wheel forcefully.

After 30 minutes of driving it goes away.

It's also not so much about complexity, but getting the right tools or information to understand what is happening. Like the right type of OBD2 reader and diagnostic tool. Most of the battle is the diagnosis and find the tools.
🤦‍♂️ 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ We get that! We got it the very first time we read your headline.

You still need to have that STEERING ANGLE SENSOR CALIBRATED post alignment and once you get your Vehicle Stability thing fixed. That is REQUIRED of all vehicles with Electric Power Steering!! And that is regardless of whether it is causing this steering wheel problem or not.

How many times do we have to repeat it??

The next time we hear from you, we expect you to report that all of those things were done.

Period.
 

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It's easier to answer a simple "Yes/No" question than a "Why" question. So...Was/is the steering angle calibrated correctly, Y/N?

If Y, and the problem(s) persist, you can look elsewhere, but at least you've eliminated steering angle as source of the problem for one or both the steering and the VSA issues...

Don't know how you'd check the steering angle sensor to make sure it's actually functioning...
 

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2010 2.4EX
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112 Posts
It's easier to answer a simple "Yes/No" question than a "Why" question.
So...Was/is the steering angle calibrated correctly, Y/N?

If Y, and the problem(s) persist, you can look elsewhere, but at least you've
eliminated steering angle as source of the problem for one or both the steering
and the VSA issues...

Don't know how you'd check the steering angle sensor to make sure it's
actually functioning...

Honestly Ronch, I'm beginning to get the feeling we're all being had here.

How many times have myself and others repeatedly suggested getting the SAS(steering angle sensor) checked and calibrated, yet we keep getting the runaround.

I suggest we all calm down, and not respond until the OP has had both the SAS and VSA(stability) at least looked at.

Then, if his steering wheel continues to do an 'Exorcist' routine, our only advice is for him to get another car - preferably an older one, still under 100,000 miles, with conventional steering and none of the SAS/VSA alphabet soup...!
 

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Discussion Starter #46
@The_K_Man @Ronch @Miker since all the OBD2 tools I have don't work and this THINKCAR 1 tool I have will only give me so much, I've scheduled an appointment at the Honda dealer this Friday.

This is all software related. Software has been developed since the 1970s (2020-1970=50 years). To people that don't develop software this is all magic, but it is not. It is just a computer automating human logic. Software development for Electric Power Steering (EPS) is much more stringent than like an APP for a phone. If the APP crashes nothing happens. If the power steering crashes, it will kill someone. There is a flow chart of all the computer logic and what is happening. American Honda is the system integrator, so they have well defined steps for all of this and defined test plans. Now, whether a technician knows this or knows how to interface with corporate to get this information is purely within his/hers limits and emotional intelligence. Meaning, whether they feel stupid about asking for information or even feel empowered to ask for this information from American Honda. Maybe their manager makes them feel like if they ask they are stupid or incompetent.

Let's see what they say on Friday.
 

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Elvira - the car
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It's easier to answer a simple "Yes/No" question than a "Why" question. So...Was/is the steering angle calibrated correctly, Y/N?

If Y, and the problem(s) persist, you can look elsewhere, but at least you've eliminated steering angle as source of the problem for one or both the steering and the VSA issues...

Don't know how you'd check the steering angle sensor to make sure it's actually functioning...
wouldn't the backup lines move based on the steering angle?

Put in reverse and look at the guide lines as you back up with the steering wheel straight on?
 

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I've read the entire thread and cannot understand why the dealer will not touch this issue, except that they can't be bothered. Some dealers just won't go toe-to-toe with the manufacturer's rep....that means their rep is a jackass, or the dealer is too lazy.

If the EPS light is going "on and off" repeatedly, and they won't do anything unless it stays on...this has already been reported to Honda more than enough times, because they don't just do replacements for torque sensors, or any crap like this, on a whim.
And it's quite common with with other makes of cars and with EPS issues, in general.(In fact, it happens frequently in VWs)
If they scan it and see the code has been stored, I'm still not sure why they won't consider that, along with the fact that the wheel is doing dangerous things like "turning itself"..
If you go into an alignment specialist and he sets up the SAS and verifies that everything is correct, get the written report, and the next time this happens, and the light goes on, take a photo with your cell phone.

I'd be on Honda America for this, like white on rice.
 

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2010 2.4EX
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I'd be on Honda America for this, like white on rice.
I'd be on whoever invented Electric Power Steering(EPS) in the first place!!

At first, I though issues like these were limited to just one or two car mfgs. worldwide, and occurring in the earlier days of EPS.

But no, it's happening across the world, to vehicles made on all three continents, and at least half a dozen carmakers!

I say go BACK TO HYDRAULIC PS as much as is possible, and admit that steering is not an area to screw around with(ok, Vladimir Lenin?) when trying to meet or beat corporate fuel economy benchmarks.

Period.
 

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I'd be on whoever invented Electric Power Steering(EPS) in the first place!!

At first, I though issues like these were limited to just one or two car mfgs. worldwide, and occurring in the earlier days of EPS.

But no, it's happening across the world, to vehicles made on all three continents, and at least half a dozen carmakers!
I can't get that emotional about all EPS systems, and you've got to realize that they're in at least 75-80% of the overall vehicle market worldwide.
It's not going to go away, it's going to get bigger and with cars going fully electric and automated, like Tesla...its increase will be huge..bank on it.
Even California wants all trucks "fully electric" very soon...

Big companies like Bosch, NSK and Denso produce many of the EPS systems with very little failure rate.

The OP has an issue with at least one of the sensors and hopefully it gets resolved, and if at fault, hopefully, Honda comes through for him.
 

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admit that steering is not an area to screw around with(ok, Vladimir Lenin?)
Well, Lenin was a hero of the (steering) revolution....he drove a Rolls Royce. I've seen it in Moscow. Along with his body.

522095



Here he is in the back seat...cruising for the ladies, no doubt.
522096
 

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2010 2.4EX
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112 Posts
I can't get that emotional about all EPS systems, and you've got to realize that they're in at least 75-80% of the overall vehicle market worldwide.
It's not going to go away, it's going to get bigger and with cars going fully electric and automated, like Tesla...its increase will be huge..bank on it.
Even California wants all trucks "fully electric" very soon...

Big companies like Bosch, NSK and Denso produce many of the EPS systems with very little failure rate.

The OP has an issue with at least one of the sensors and hopefully it gets resolved, and if at fault, hopefully, Honda comes through for him.
Situations like krisdev's would be a problem if we didn't make it a problem in the first place.

Same with Digital broadcast TV: Analog worked for over 60 years. I'd rather have a weakening channel fade to snow and still be heard, than the present all-or-nothing cutouts associated with fringe reception of digital OTA(Over The Air).

In summary, via the electric steering and digital TV examples above, and in too many other arenas, we choose, of our own free will, to complicate our lives, to achieve straightforward means via a crooked path.

Choices.

Well, I choose tried n true. That's why I drive a 8th Gen Accord, not a generation later than that. ;)
 

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2010 2.4EX
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I hear ya.

My favorite cookie is still the Oreo!


Can't get any simpler than that.
You wish.

I forced myself to give up one of my favorite store-bought cookies
since production of it - and many other Nabisco items - was moved out of the U.S.

Make America Great?..

Start with our OWN cookies, and toilet seats. ;)
 

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2010 2.4EX
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My taste preference is Oreo. Just unfortunate they both cannot be MIUSA! (Made In)

Oh, and how did krisdev's appt go on Friday?
 

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You wish.

I forced myself to give up one of my favorite store-bought cookies
since production of it - and many other Nabisco items - was moved out of the U.S.

Make America Great?..

Start with our OWN cookies, and toilet seats. ;)
Yeah, yeah...they called it Oreo-Gate, or something like that, at one time..
They're actually made in a few countries including the U.S. ..you gotta look for the "AH" code that's how you know..
I know people, personally, that only buy "American made", but if you're going to do that, you'll probably never buy any clothes, or car parts, or....
It's a global economy.
 

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2010 2.4EX
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Yeah, yeah...they called it Oreo-Gate, or something like that, at one time..
They're actually made in a few countries including the U.S. ..you gotta look for the "AH" code that's how you know..
I know people, personally, that only buy "American made", but if you're going to do that, you'll probably never buy any clothes, or car parts, or....
It's a global economy.
But a country's own food? I consider that essential.

As far as other countries cara go, why do you think we all love Hondas? lol

What I'd really love to get into is the Accord the rest of the world got during the 7th gen years, and during the 8th gen, when North America got the largest Accords ever - large, but would outhandle my '81 Buick Century - parked.

I saw on Wikipedia what looked a lot closer to an Acura TL or RL of that time period(2003-12).
 

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I saw on Wikipedia what looked a lot closer to an Acura TL or RL of that time period(2003-12).
The TL was the Euro "Accord". That's always been my favorite, but not the one with the infamous "buck toothed" grille...
I'd prefer the earlier ones...('08 and earlier)
 

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2010 2.4EX
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The TL was the Euro "Accord". That's always been my favorite,
but not the one with the infamous "buck toothed" grille...
I'd prefer the earlier ones...('08 and earlier)
So the 2008-12, and to some extent the 9th gen succeeding it, was marketed for big American bodies I supposed?

The 6th Gen North American Accord, and its derivative successor, the 7th(2003-07) have among the highest Consumerguide marks for handling and overall performance of Accords since 1990. Those versions of Accord would be barely larger than current Civics actually! Which might explain their high road performance ratings.
 
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