[benjaminh]

My family has owned 4 Accords (a 2002, 2008, 2013, and 2016), and I've always looked down on the Camry as a rental car with a marshmallow suspension and inferior ergonomics. But the all-new 2018 Camry apparently has significantly better handling, a more ergonomic interior, and, Toyota claims, best-in-class mpg.

For me, one of the great things about all of our Accords has been the outstanding visibility all around. With the new fastback design, and the inferior rear window treatment, rear visibility is clearly compromised for the 2018 Accord. The 2018 Camry seems superior in terms of rear visibility.

Anyway, the Accord and Camry have been battling for first place in car sales in the US since the mid-1980s. What do you think is going to happen with these all-new midsize cars? And which one between these would you pick, and why?

 

[RickBlaine]

New Accord, Camry struggle for relevance as sedan sales plummet

Sedan sales are dropping. Camry and Accord are taking different approaches to retain sales leadership....

 

[bradt93]

Camry, because the exterior is just better looking.

 

[vinuneuro]

No Android Auto Apple Carplay automatically disqualifies Toyota products for me. Hopefully they wake up soon.

 

[Graycar]

No Android Auto Apple Carplay automatically disqualifies Toyota products for me. Hopefully they wake up soon.

That seems to be especially stupid on the part of Toyota. I wonder how the Toyota Spin Department justifies omission of this popular feature?

Surely, Toyota will be forced to add CarPlay and Android Auto in the near future.

 

[slimm1469]

Camry is a car for people who don't like cars.

 

[benboy12]

I will potentially be making this decision in the fall. I really can't decide until I actually drive them, but here are my initial thoughts:

Camry Pluses/Accord Minuses

1.) V6 with more HP than turbo 4
2.) Panoramic Sunroof
3.) Higher Quality Audio
4.) Good color options (I love the bright blue).
5.) 360 degree camera
6.) More conservative styling (not really sure if this is a plus or minus here)
7.) Bigger HUD (not sure if I will really care about the extra 4 inches)

Accord Pluses/Camry minuses

1.) I actually like german influenced interior
2.) More interior room/interior looks higher end
3.) Apple CarPlay (As someone who has an iPhone and has an Apple Music subscription this is pretty important).
4.) Ventilated Seats
5.) Honda has a better track record for making more "fun to drive" automobiles
6.) Top of the line Accord will most likely be $2k-3k cheaper than a top of the line Camry

I am coming from a 2014 Accord EX-L V6. Its a great car, but I have some family members in need of a car (who can't afford one). So my plan is to give them my Accord and get myself something else. I want to lean towards the Accord because I am a Honda guy, but I am willing to give another reliable auto maker a try.

 

[benjaminh]

Camry sales peaked in 2007, with sales of 473,108 cars. In 2007 Honda was able to sell 392,231 Accords, which was good for second place—but a rather distant second. Fast forward to 2017, and so far, year-to-date, the Camry is still ahead with sales of 176,897 in the first six months of this year, while Accord is a closer second at 160,091. Since Honda sells very few Accords as rentals, and Toyota sells a lot of Camrys as rentals (c. 20%?), Honda has claimed that retail buyers prefer the current Accord.

Anyway the 30+ year all-out battle between these two midsize cars is seemingly going to be fiercer than ever starting in a few months. Right now the last of the 2017 Camrys and Accords are being sold at discount prices, but already production of the 2018 Camry has begun at Toyota's huge factory in Kentucky. Honda's huge Accord factory in Ohio won't start production for another couple of months.

Anyway, which of these cars do you think will be the winner with customers within a declining midsize market? Each company has seemingly thrown billions of dollars of engineering muscle into making these the best midsize cars ever. Which one do you think will win, and why?

I'll try to compare what we know so far about the 2018 Camry and 2018 Accord in terms of features, interior room and trunk space, engines and transmissions, handling, and the very subjective area of styling. Hope some others will join in with their thoughts as well....

 

[bgreen83]

I am in the same position as I was comparing the 2 cars. I simply can’t bring myself to pay the price that Toyota wants for a V6 Camry. I have another buddy that was set on the XSE V6 and when he saw the price without some of the options he wants he basically threw in the towel. If I decided not to get the Accord a gently used Lexus GS or ES (2016) would be a better deal to me over the new Camry. Preferably a GS…

I think the options in the Accord are hard to beat although I am not a fan of the rear. I don’t care about the difference in the HUD size. They both basically give you the same information. Speed, RPM, navigation and traffic. I love the Accord has these options. Memory Seats, Cooled Seats, Android Auto, Full Digitial Display (HUGE PLUS), NFC and Rain Sensing Wipers. The Camry will win with the audio system, but that can be fixed. I also think the seats are going to be a lot more comfortable than the Camry XSE.

I have always had Hondas and my family has had Toyotas as well. Quite frankly most of my Accords just looked OK on the exterior. I think we were spoiled on the 9th generation and that’s why people are so upset. But let’s be honest. How many cars out here today can we say really look good? Not many in my eyes. I wish the Mazda 6 redesign would happen soon because it would be on my short list.
I also think we need to reserve judgment on the 250hp 2.0T until we drive it. Those specs are similar to a lot of those engines. The Malibu is 250/260 and is slightly faster than the current V6 Camry and Accord. The E class only has 240hp and the specs of the Accord are the same as the A4 which has a 0-60 time of 5.2 seconds. Based on the survey one of the writers here put out the Accord will be 0-60 in 5.4 seconds.

My family has owned 4 Accords (a 2002, 2008, 2013, and 2016), and I've always looked down on the Camry as a rental car with a marshmallow suspension and inferior ergonomics. But the all-new 2018 Camry apparently has significantly better handling, a more ergonomic interior, and, Toyota claims, best-in-class mpg.

For me, one of the great things about all of our Accords has been the outstanding visibility all around. With the new fastback design, and the inferior rear window treatment, rear visibility is clearly compromised for the 2018 Accord. The 2018 Camry seems superior in terms of rear visibility.

Anyway, the Accord and Camry have been battling for first place in car sales in the US since the mid-1980s. What do you think is going to happen with these all-new midsize cars? And which one between these would you pick, and why?

I would definitely hold out with the drive for handling. The presentation on Friday said best in class MPG for the Accord. I also think the 2.0T will prob handle better than the Camry with just the reduced weight alone.

 

[benjaminh]

In terms of features, both the 2018 Camry and the 2018 Accord are going to be impressively equipped for "base" models. The 2018 Camry LE lists for $24,900 with destination, and includes a lot of standard stuff....

https://www.toyota.com/camry/camry-features/

For instance, the 2018 Camry LE has "Safety Sense" as standard, which includes pre-collision pedestrian detection, lane departure alert with steering assist, automatic high beams, and Dynamic radar cruise control. Most of that stuff I personally feel mixed about, but the last feature is something that I'd like—and it was only available on high-priced Lexus models just a few years ago.

The 2018 Camry LE also has 17" tires with alloy wheels standard, Toyota's Entune 3.0 with navi w/7" display, 8-way power driver's seat, 60/40 split folding rear seat, "wood" interior trim, 4 window auto up/down, led illuminated glove box, etc.

That's pretty impressive for the entry-level model. Although in fact, strangely, in about 5 months, for $500 less, you'll be able to get the even more base L model, which eliminates the power seat and other stuff to save weight and costs, ultimately boosting mpg a little. I think very few people are going to get the L...

In terms of equipment on the 2018 Accord LX, we don't have quite the same level of detail, and we don't know the pricing yet, but I very much doubt it'll be more than $400 more than the Camry LE. But there is a lot of info at Honda's site:

Dramatic Design of Reimagined 2018 Honda Accord Signals New Direction for America?s Retail Best-Selling Midsize Sedan - Honda News

Every 2018 Accord is going to have HondaSensing, which is mostly similar to Toyota's "Safety Sense." Honda's radar cruise control system is maybe a little bit better than Toyota's. Looks like Toyota has a basic system for the lower levels of trim, and then a fancier system that can deal with lower speeds on the upper trims and with option packages. Honda has the standard low speed cruise across the line.

But the big win for Honda here is standard AndroidAuto/Apple CarPlay, which Toyota strangely doesn't offer. The Accord LX is almost certainly not going to offer a power seat, but ultimately having lived with AndroidAuto in my 2016 Accord for a year, and loving it, I think that Toyota really missed the boat here, handing Honda a significant competitive advantage. Also, Honda is giving at standard 8" display for this on the base model, while Toyota only gives 8 inches on the upper trim.

I think the 2018 Accord beats the 2018 Camry on interior features because of AndroidAuto/Apple CarPlay. And if you need a power seat for your Accord, you can always step up to a higher model to get it. But even the top of the line Camry will still have "Entune."

Camry is a car for people who don't like cars.

Yes, that's been completely true up until now, but when the 2018 Camry hits dealers in a few weeks that's going to change. Apparently this Camry is actually fun to drive. Here's what Car and Driver said:

"With either engine, the Camry driving experience has been elevated. Toyota engineers claim to have lowered the car’s center of gravity by an inch, while the TNGA platform brought a change from a strut-type rear suspension to a multilink setup. The chassis is remarkably stoic and gamely resists body roll. In gentler driving, there’s a newfound poise that replaces the somnambulant motions of the previous car. The steering has real weight that builds nicely as you turn the wheel. "

2018 Toyota Camry First Drive | Review | Car and Driver

 

[bgreen83]

I think another feature that is underrated unless you've had it is the auto brake hold. This is standard now in a lot of Honda's including the Accord, but I noticed it's not standard on the Camry, but still available. The infotainment system in the new Accord and Odyssey even without AA/AC I believe is much better than Entune. Alex on Autos just did a review and said it was easily the best and his favorite in the minivan segment.

 

[benjaminh]

Here's what Motor Trend says about the 2018 Camry's "Entune":

"One user-interfacepalm: No Apple CarPlay or Android Auto availability. Toyota is feuding with both software companies for refusing to fully disclose the workings and security protocols of their back-end programming—so it developed its own app, called Scout GPS. It works in conjunction with Toyota’s Entune app to bring phone-based navigation along with the typical music streaming, news, stock, sports, and other apps to lower-level infotainment systems. (Top trims get embedded navigation.) The shortcomings: Your phone must be tethered via both Bluetooth and the cord and needs the Scout app live on the screen; there’s no easy way to push an address from your phone to Scout. It’s also a subscription service (free for three years then $25 per year)."

2018 Toyota Camry First Drive Review - Motor Trend

 

[bradt93]

Toyota Camry for the win as far as looks goes. I like the sport version.

 

[benjaminh]

Toyota Camry for the win as far as looks goes. I like the sport version.

Well, looks are obviously very subjective. For instance, I really think the Camry Sport has been hit with an ugly stick! :nerd The Camry I like is actually the LE.

The new 2018 Accord is growing on me, but the front seems a little unfinished with that open-grill look. On the other hand, it's probably flat out functional for cooling—let the air in for that Honda turbo!

Looking at the design of the dash on the 2018 Camry, it's clearly a huge step up from the last generation. Shown is a higher end model with navi and the 8" screen. Standard on the lower trims is a 7" screen....

When I first saw pix of the 2018 Camry dash a few months ago I thought it wouldn't be possible for Honda to top it with the 2018 Accord, but I think I was wrong. For starters, the 2018 Accord has a standard 8" screen. And what Honda calls their "slim look" for their dash is growing on me. I also think Honda's knobs look more upscale and functional than found on the Camry. But they are both very nice, and seem ergonomically to be well designed. Anyone else have any thoughts?

 

[benjaminh]

Someone has posted a video visual comparison....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVN4B-_qRpM

 

[meowcat]

That Camry is ugly, inside and out! The center stack (if you can call it that) is beyond hideous. It hurts my eyes to look at it. Where is the symmetry?
The Camry has never been a better handling car than the Accord and I don't see that happening here. The Accord has always been a bit stiffer than the Camry but at least the suspension remains pretty unflappable. The Camry, no matter how well they make it handle of how stiff the suspension will be, it will always remain "softer" than the Accord. By "softer", I mean flappable. Nearly every Lexus and Toyota I've ever driven has been soft and flappable. My current 2017 ES350 has plenty of grip but you just never know what's going on between the road and the tires. All I want to do when I drive it is go to sleep. You can feel the suspension reverberate over road bumps, (flappable) the Accord, not so much. The ES is a nice car, don't get me wrong, but my Accord does the dynamics so much better. It is my belief that it will remain that way between the Accord and Camry.

 

[vinuneuro]

I don't think the new Accord is perfect, but recent Toyota products including the Camry look as if they have a new mandate to drop acid at work.

 

[isaccth1]

I think another feature that is underrated unless you've had it is the auto brake hold. This is standard now in a lot of Honda's including the Accord, but I noticed it's not standard on the Camry, but still available. The infotainment system in the new Accord and Odyssey even without AA/AC I believe is much better than Entune. Alex on Autos just did a review and said it was easily the best and his favorite in the minivan segment.

Currently no 2017 Accords have Brake Hold or e parking brake. Are you sure all 2018 Accord trims get e park brake / hold feature? ...
...which in turn allows Low Speed Follow for ACC which in turn means if you hit slow down to zero MPH on wherever, your car will stop on its own. .... and go if tap resume or accelerator.
But, will it do a good job and get close to car ahead like most would or will it leave a car and half gap?

2018 Camry doesn't get e park brake / hold until you get up to XLE or hybrid SE trims which is about $29.5 and $30.5k sticker w/o extra options.

 

[datechbpss101]

Toyota still sucks IMO, even if they try to make their products top-notch. Even, up to this day, Toyota has the worst recalls in automotive history. The interior when compared to the 2018 Accord, the Accord wins in every way, and that's due to the influence of MB and BMW. The exterior, its a combination of really great cars that has really great lines. And to top things off, TOYOTA DOES NOT HAVE CARPLAY AND ANDROID AUTO!! This in my opinion that the answer is a no-brainer since Honda wins. Plus, I am literally considering getting the 2.0T touring model, since my garage is filled with 4 bangers.

 

[datechbpss101]

Currently no Accords have Brake Hold or e parking brake. What I'm wondering is if all 2018 Accords will get electric parking brake / Brake Hold which in turn allows Low Speed Follow for ACC which in turn means if you hit slow down to zero MPH on wherever, your car will stop on its own. ....
But, will it do a good job and get close to car ahead like most would or will it leave a car and half gap?

2018 Camry doesn't get e park brake / hold until you get up to XLE or hybrid SE trims which is about $29.5 and $30.5k sticker w/o extra options.

All 2018 Accords, like the Civics, Odyssey, CRV, and HRV, will have the Brake hold, and electric parking brake.