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V6 resale vs I4

9K views 49 replies 18 participants last post by  Hogan773 
#1 ·
Here's a question for thought.....I know that you probably won't recoup the value of the extra $2000 for the V6 at resale in, say 8 years (some though, but not all).

But now that there is more push by society and the government for fuel efficiency, do people think that in 8 years if I were to sell my car:

A) Honda will have stopped making a V6 Accord entirely, and therefore a 2014 V6 will be MORE desirable to enthusiasts?

B) More and more cars will have continued to improve their MPG (lots more hybrids and 4 cyls by then) such that the "norm" will be to get 45+ mpg with good performance, and therefore a 2014 V6 gulping 21 mpg in city will be seen as LESS desirable...more of a dinosaur?

Before the flamers come on to say that I am overanalyzing and have used my allotment of posts since I haven't yet bought a car, just be aware that I'm not hinging any decision on this answer....but just thought of it and wondered what smart minds would think.
 
#3 ·
a) is negated because there's not really any "enthusiasts" driving an Accord. Plus there's several other models that have more power in this price segment.

V6 vs. I4 is probably a better investment than EX-L vs. LX. No one is going to pay $2k extra for leather seats.
 
#4 ·
It seems reasonable to think that Honda could go away from the V6 in the Accord in the future but who knows; it could go either way. Right now, I believe only Toyota & Honda offer v6 engine options in their mid size sedans.

I seriously don't think that the "norm" in 8yrs will be 45+ mpg. The Prius has been there for ages and the Insight is just about there yet you don't see them en masse everywhere.

All IMO
 
#5 ·
drive a car for 8-10 years and it's practically worthless. A few K down on your next one. Honda knows it's audience, there are enough that want the V6 and all the turbo 4's on the market just make it stronger. Keep it 25 yrs and it'll have some value where as the 4 will have none. Don't see folks with classic Chevelle's getting 6mpg having trouble selling their cars do you???
 
#7 ·
yeah I plugged it prices to Edmunds for a hypothetical 2007 model and it appeared to be about $1,000 more for the V6.

I think the V6 is calling but we'll see whether emotion wins over logic. The logic of the I4 is pretty hard to beat especially for mostly city driving, but it wasn't logical for me to order a $99 steak last night either but here we are and sometimes the human brain does illogical things :thmsup:
 
#9 ·
When you get out to 8 to 10 years the miles on the car and its condition make all the difference in how much it will be worth on the used car market.
 
#12 ·
It's about $1k difference in resale. Also keep in kind the V6 has a timing belt vs. a timing chain on the 4 which will need changed around 100k ($500-800 job).

Pick what you want, enjoy it. Don't worry about the difference if it's what you really want and will make you happy for years to come.
 
#13 ·
I have to say people who think that the V6 will be worth more in the long run are just plain wrong considering the premium they pay for the option. I have had both and when they get old the 4 cylinder is always easier to sell and I always get more than KBB than the V6's I've sold. Most people in the market for a high mileage older Honda do not want a V6. Generally speaking you can almost always get at least 5k or more for any good running Honda 4 cylinder here in California <200k 1998 and above.
 
#14 ·
Generally speaking you can almost always get at least 5k or more for any good running Honda 4 cylinder here in California <200k 1998 and above.
Now, now, this can't possibly true nationwide or in California. A 1999 EX I-4 with 200,000 is worth around $2,900. So obviously, it cannot be worth $5,000 more than V-6 (in fact, a V-6 with same specs would be worth around the same, $2,900). This is also true for later model years - logically, it is not possible to have a $5,000 difference, regardless of your anecdotal stories. Sorry.

Like OP and others said, if the car were 8 years old per OP's scenario, the I-4/V-6 difference would be around $1,000.

Mick
 
#15 ·
Here's a question for thought.....I know that you probably won't recoup the value of the extra $2000 for the V6 at resale in, say 8 years (some though, but not all). In 8 years the V6 will not likely net anything at all, especially if you haven't done the timing belt maintence.

But now that there is more push by society and the government for fuel efficiency, do people think that in 8 years if I were to sell my car:

A) Honda will have stopped making a V6 Accord entirely, and therefore a 2014 V6 will be MORE desirable to enthusiasts? Might be true, though many will want more current technology

B) More and more cars will have continued to improve their MPG (lots more hybrids and 4 cyls by then) such that the "norm" will be to get 45+ mpg with good performance, and therefore a 2014 V6 gulping 21 mpg in city will be seen as LESS desirable...more of a dinosaur? exactly!

Before the flamers come on to say that I am overanalyzing and have used my allotment of posts since I haven't yet bought a car, just be aware that I'm not hinging any decision on this answer....but just thought of it and wondered what smart minds would think.
Really a good thinto think through all of the angles. Trouble is - it's easy to enter the "Analysis paralisis" zone, and stay there.
 
#22 ·
1. I haven't seen this discussed, but perhaps most important: I know that the MSRP difference is $2,000 but the real life difference is much less than that. When I was shopping last year around this time, the lowest price I found on EX-L I-4 was $25,800 and on EX-L V-6 was $27,100. That's only $1,300 more and, assuming you can recoup $1,000 upon sale, you can do the math. I got a V-6 and made the right decision for myself.

2. Even if the engine efficiencies would have advanced that much, folks who would buy an 8-year Accord obviously cannot afford (or want) a new car. They will likely be comparing Accord to other 6-10 year old used cars, none of which would have superior MPG in any meaningful way.

3. Who knows if V-6s would be extinct in 8 years. I doubt it. Hybrids have been around for 10 years, but they have not killed the conventional engines. It takes a long time for the masses to adopt new technologies before they become truly ubiquitous.

4. If V-6s become much, much less popular, I think you are right that it would be more sought after than now. There will always be people who prefer V-6 over I-4, hybrid or plug-in. That is ingrained in our minds ever since we first started driving - that V-6 is better than I-4 because of superior smoothness, power, higher price, yada, yada, yada. As long as there are climate change deniers (that's like half of the country, at least), you would have eager V-6 buyers.

5. Remember too that you get more than just a V-6 engine. I love the LED DRL's in my V-6. They make the car look so much more upscale and aggressive. I have seen aftermarket LED DRL's in Accords and they are not anywhere as bright. You also get Homelink, which I don't get excited about but a lot of folks desire that around here. Also, you get dual chrome exhaust tips. All of those things should be in your calculus.

6. I think you are having a "paralysis by analysis." :) Buying a family sedan is not like buying a house or marrying someone. With an Accord, you can readily undo your decision and not lose too much on resale no matter when you get rid of it. You strike me as a very smart, (over?) analytical person. If you sense an unfavorable trend that adversely affect the resale value, I am sure you can move before the others realize it.

7. Just go buy a V-6 Accord already! As a great philosopher named Robin Thicke once said, "You know you want it." Good luck, bro!

Mick

Hahaha that is specifically why I noted that I WASN'T hinging my model decision on this factor cause I knew you guys would come back to me telling me I'm "analyzing too much" :) I was just thinking about it so thought it was an interesting question more about whether the trend towards fuel economy would negatively impact the perception or value of cars in a decade's time.

Look, when I buy things I like to understand what I'm buying and why. In today's markets (not just cars but everywhere) there is a lot of flim flam and marketing claims and "segmentation" and "premiumization" thrown out there by companies. I have the "value gene" so while I am fortunate to have money, I also don't like to part with it unless I'm doing so for a specific reason. As such, when I buy a TV or a car or a bike or whatever, my mind tries to understand what I'm actually GETTING when I look at Low, Middle and High "segments" that the marketers all seem to create for us. So first job is to understand what you get by stepping up to the next level, then the next job is to determine whether I PERSONALLY CARE about those additional features.

Case in point....I could care less about NAV, so the Touring trim is meaningless to me because I also don't care enough about LED headlights to pay an extra few thousand. But I agree with Mick that I'm pretty intrigued (and leaning to) the extra value you get by going V6, since I was gonna do leather anyway. Totally understand that if an LX or EX is acceptable to a buyer, then stepping to EXL V6 is a bigger $$$ step, but for me an extra $1500-2000 makes it a very reasonable choice.

Just to be clear about my "timing" (or WHY DOESNT HE JUST BUY THE CAR ALREADY)....I've got several biz trips this week and next, plus our house will be crazy this weekend for a family member wedding, so unfortunately it's been impossible for me to sneak away and go spend some real time test driving a V6. Until I can do that, I can't confirm my choice, but I do have a smartphone and I'm thinking about this Honda Accord stuff a lot as you can tell, and my mind is active on it, so it's easy to post another question or thought to the best Accord forum in the world even while I'm waiting for a flight or something. At this point I'm definitely leaning to "treating myself" to the V6 (even though I know in my mind that the I4 would be great too and really is the more logical choice for this segment given the cost differential and fuel savings), so I'm hoping when I do get the time to test drive the V6 I won't find something that deflates me like "the steering is worse than the I4" as mentioned elsewhere. Fingers crossed
 
#16 ·
1. I haven't seen this discussed, but perhaps most important: I know that the MSRP difference is $2,000 but the real life difference is much less than that. When I was shopping last year around this time, the lowest price I found on EX-L I-4 was $25,800 and on EX-L V-6 was $27,100. That's only $1,300 more and, assuming you can recoup $1,000 upon sale, you can do the math. I got a V-6 and made the right decision for myself.

2. Even if the engine efficiencies would have advanced that much, folks who would buy an 8-year Accord obviously cannot afford (or want) a new car. They will likely be comparing Accord to other 6-10 year old used cars, none of which would have superior MPG in any meaningful way.

3. Who knows if V-6s would be extinct in 8 years. I doubt it. Hybrids have been around for 10 years, but they have not killed the conventional engines. It takes a long time for the masses to adopt new technologies before they become truly ubiquitous.

4. If V-6s become much, much less popular, I think you are right that it would be more sought after than now. There will always be people who prefer V-6 over I-4, hybrid or plug-in. That is ingrained in our minds ever since we first started driving - that V-6 is better than I-4 because of superior smoothness, power, higher price, yada, yada, yada. As long as there are climate change deniers (that's like half of the country, at least), you would have eager V-6 buyers.

5. Remember too that you get more than just a V-6 engine. I love the LED DRL's in my V-6. They make the car look so much more upscale and aggressive. I have seen aftermarket LED DRL's in Accords and they are not anywhere as bright. You also get Homelink, which I don't get excited about but a lot of folks desire that around here. Also, you get dual chrome exhaust tips. All of those things should be in your calculus.

6. I think you are having a "paralysis by analysis." :) Buying a family sedan is not like buying a house or marrying someone. With an Accord, you can readily undo your decision and not lose too much on resale no matter when you get rid of it. You strike me as a very smart, (over?) analytical person. If you sense an unfavorable trend that adversely affect the resale value, I am sure you can move before the others realize it.

7. Just go buy a V-6 Accord already! As a great philosopher named Robin Thicke once said, "You know you want it." Good luck, bro!

Mick
 
#29 ·
6. I think you are having a "paralysis by analysis." :) Buying a family sedan is not like buying a house or marrying someone. With an Accord, you can readily undo your decision and not lose too much on resale no matter when you get rid of it. You strike me as a very smart, (over?) analytical person. If you sense an unfavorable trend that adversely affect the resale value, I am sure you can move before the others realize it.



Mick
Personally I think he may suffer from OCPD after reading his posts on his pending purchase. One of the symptoms is trying to find the perfect answer to a problem.

This is just an observation from someone who has been diagnosed with OCPD himself. Having worked with professionals to help me with it I can now pick it out in people pretty quick.

This is not a slam on Hogan, just an observation, and I sympathize with him.

Jay
 
#17 ·
Shopping the cars right you'll find the V6 can be had for only $1,200 to $1,500 more than the i4. I don't want to threadjack into a CVT's are unreliable thread, but the CVT was a deal breaker FOR ME on the i4. You can hope and dream that it's a Honda and it'll be fine, but it's simply not time tested. Being that my CVT failed on my 13 altima in under 10,000 miles I was not about to jump into another one. $1,500 bought piece of mind and provided a much higher performance driving experience for me. If I get an extra thousand when I sell it I've only spent $500 for it...no brainer to me:yes: Check this out...CVT failure is a sticky on the nissan board: http://www.nissanclub.com/forums/2013-nissan-altima-discussion-2-5-3-5/373161-cvt-replacement-list-5th-gens-only.html
 
#18 ·
But they don't make an LX V6, or else I would have bought that. But the difference between the LX I4 and the EX V6 was such a huge price difference that it became cost prohibitive when I was buying. (I don't need/want navi, leather, backup camera, etc).
 
#19 ·
True, they used to offer an LX V6 (when I bought my 04 EX). Wonder why they did away with that. Guess they want to only offer V6 in more premium trim...:dunno:
 
#20 ·
Just traded my 09 V6 in June. The trade offer was done for a 4cyl first, they forgot it was a V6. I got just over 2K Canadian more once they realized it was a V6. The market here is really tough, trade in values are horrible, I could have gotten more if I drove off the island to the next province.

It sold the day it hit the lot.
 
#23 · (Edited)
This thread is great and I'm learning al lot. Was in market for EV-L I-4, but the more I read & learn I'm now leaning towards the V6; especially if i can obtain one for < $28k. I live in Morris County NJ, can someone tell me which NJ dealership tends to discount Accords more than others? I'll even drive 1 hour away if necessary.. thanks
 
#24 ·
Yes, please come join the dark side of V-6!!

Getting one for less than $28K should be a piece of cake, even for a 2014.

Shoot an email to the Internet Manager at each dealership within a 2 hour radius for a quote. I know you would like to keep it within 1 hour, but the dealers wouldn't know that. :) Refuse to go in unless they give you their best price in writing (most would willingly give you an internet quote).

Then play one against the other - e.g., "X offered to sell it to me for $27,000. Can you beat it?." The Internet Managers will readily tell you when they simply cannot beat a competitor's price. When you have the best price, take it to the closest local dealer one last time (via email) and ask to beat/match (buying from a local dealer would save you time and fuel on multiple travel). Voila, you don't have to spend several hours under high pressure situation to get your best deal. Easy. This method works a lot better than the internet buying services.

Just don't let your guard down after you negotiate the price - they will try to rip you off on the financing rate, accessories, various warranties, etc., etc. in the finance office. Pinstripes for $200 and an alarm for $800 are my favorites. Ditto for any trade-in.

Good luck!!

Mick
 
#27 ·
thx Mick, I hear you on the purchase advice.. few folks at work suggested same. But I do have a major variable of possible trade-in of excellent condition '06 330ci with 72k miles.. car is loaded w/all pkgs at the time; Premium/Sport/Cold Weather/OEM 18" Wheels/HK Speakers. I bought it certified in early 2009 with 35k miles.. its been a gem
 
#39 ·
Actually, I had a trade, too ('06 550i). I went through the bidding process I outlined first, without mentioning anything about having a trade. If they asked, I told them I wasn't sure, it depends.

Once you narrow it down to like two or three dealers, you can go in and have your BMW appraised. They will try to f$%^ you. With a hot curling iron. My recommendations:

1. At the very minimum, walk in with printouts from KBB, Black Book and NADA for your car, because you know they will claim that one or more of those is "overpriced." Funny, they readily point to those sources when you are buying a used car from them . . . .

2. They will invariably tell you that your car cannot be sold on their lot and therefore must be auctioned (i.e., "we can give you only wholesale"). BS, they lie all the time - mine had my car on the lot two days later after they made a big deal about how they can't sell an exotic on their lot. Right. :) At least, you should ask them to print out the auction sale price history for comparable BMWs (and make sure they are indeed comparable - i.e., equipment, mileage, condition, etc.). You could see what they say if you insist that, if they sell retail, they have to cut you a check for $XX.

3. I guarantee they will ask, "how much you want for your trade? What's that, $XX?" followed by "if we give you $XX for your trade, would you buy from us today?" Make sure you give them a figure that they wouldn't agree to, like KBB's private party value at perfect condition. If you give a lesser figure in the beginning, you are boxing yourself in - the dealer would not give you more than your "ask" even if the dealer knows the car is worth more.

4. Don't start any negotiation until you get your keys back after the trade appraisal. Dealers are known to waste hours of your time to wear you down and to exert an unethical amount of pressure. It is paramount that you are able to just get up and leave (that's a very effective negotiating tactic, too). Tell them you would prefer to just wait with a cup of coffee; or have someone give you a ride somewhere until they are ready.

It is a pain in the arse when you have a trade, because you obviously can't compare valuations via email. Once they have you in the showroom, they will pull out everything from their trick book to ensure you don't walk out without a car. Persevere, my friend.

Mick
 
#31 ·
I didn't physically go anywhere except to test drive before starting the process. Needed to know specific trim I wanted before breaking peoples' balls. Once I decided Sport, it was on.

Saturday is what dealers live for, especially near month-end. Gathered internet quotes Wed-Fri, called regular salesmen on Sat morning and walked in that afternoon to sign with lowest bidder.

Edit: You have to speak with confidence on the phone, if you sound like a bitch nobody cares what you found online. And you have to get their absolute promise that if you walk in with a pen in your hand, they'll honor their verbal price.

Internet quotes are only valid if they promise out-the-door price, useless otherwise. Demand it with your inquiry each time.

Then spell out facts quickly on the phone. OTD price for this trim/color from x-dealer, can you beat it. No? Thanks for your time. On to the next.
 
#32 ·
I didn't physically go anywhere except to test drive before starting the process. Needed to know specific trim I wanted before breaking peoples' balls. Once I decided Sport, it was on.

Saturday is what dealers live for, especially near month-end. Gathered internet quotes Wed-Fri, called regular salesmen on Sat morning and walked in that afternoon to sign with lowest bidder.

Edit: You have to speak with confidence on the phone, if you sound like a bitch nobody cares what you found online. And you have to get their absolute promise that if you walk in with a pen in your hand, they'll honor their verbal price.
Haha yeah I can't wait for the game to begin. Not sure I can get my act together to hit this coming "month end window" or whether I'll have to wait for Thanksgiving time. Although maybe if month end only saves $50 in the end, it's not worth waiting.
 
#33 ·
Eh, month-end best pricing is probably from dealers with poor numbers. Inherently not the greatest sales dep't, just make sure you can temporarily live with service dep't. Any initial problems are taken care of by original dealer, past that go where you'd like.

As to amount of savings, I like to believe only one $500 reduction would have happened early in the month. Will never know for sure, but I have an inkling.
 
#34 ·
Eh, month-end best pricing is probably from dealers with poor numbers. Inherently not the greatest sales dep't, be sure service dep't is up to par - any initial problems are taken care of by your original dealer, past that go where you'd like.
What does this mean? I'd think that any problems under warranty are treatable at ANY dealer right? I mean if I ended up buying from a dealer 35 miles away, I can still take my car into the service dept of the dealer that is 1 mile away from my house.
 
#35 ·
In a black & white world, sure. You're assuming any problem...no matter how minor...is covered under warranty. Much easier getting the small stuff worked out at original dealer.

Mine jumped through hoops to check out a light brake squeek and interior rattle (replaced sunglasses holder, really doubt a rattle is under warranty). I work about 30 minutes away, they drove out a loaner and swapped for my car - I just had to exchange keys. Car returned once problems solved. There are at least 3 Honda dealers between us.

We all know you'd sweat the small stuff, bud. ;)

Edit: I'm talking within first 1,000 miles. Past that you just pray warranty covers whatever comes up.
 
#36 ·
We all can return to any dealer for warranty work regardless where purchased; I have Honda dealer within walkng distance of my townhouse (we recently sold a large home on acreage, too much work.. ha-ha); but I'll buy an hour away if necessary & then use local dealer for any potential warranty work (hope not needed of course)
 
#42 ·
thanks Mick & everyone regarding my potential BMW trade. (and fyi.. no Carmax's in NJ to my knowledge). My last 5 vehicles I have sold privately due to all being in VG/Excellent condition & average miles since I have an extra vehicle. That is always my 1st route, especially with a decent priced 330ci 6-speed that a youngster may love. Car is quick & excellent MPG. Also has OEM 18" Michelin Pilot Sport Z-rated Tires (255/35 in rear and 225/40 in front). Also have set of 4 Dunlop Sport 17" winter tires w/separate alloys that go on car every late November. I have looked up the car in KBB, NADA & Edmunds and seems to range from $11-12k for trade-in and 13-14.5k for Private Party.

I have always heard on trade-ins from Consumer Reports; always negogiate a sales price on new vehicle and then mention a potential trade. But I never have had to practice that in real life for last 20 years due to all private sales.
 
#43 ·
Never thought about resale value. As long as the car satisfies my requirements I will keep it. I will drive the car to ground then buy a new one.
BTW in my driving cycle I have got so far average 33 real world MPG from my Accord Touring 2013 and it's satisfy my requirements. It's better MPG than my previous Accord hybrid 2007.
 
#44 ·
All this discussion is great as I will be in the same position, with a potential trade of a BMW 325XI.

I am thinking that I will whittle it down to 3 or 4 of the lowest prices on the new car, then take the car in personally to try to get a good trade in price. I am somewhat incentivized to do the trade since I have to sell it privately for 8% higher just to break even (and that doesn't count the time spent, risks of having weirdos from Craigslist come to the house, etc). HOWEVER if they all lowball me too much then I will just walk and sell it myself.

I checked KBB, NADA and Edmunds right now. I think the Edmunds engine must be broken since it is claiming $4700 for the BMW while the others are closer to $7000. I think the dealer would put it on the lot at $9999 and try to sell it somewhere in the mid 8s. If they gave me $7000-7500 I'd probably take it, since that gets me pretty close after adjusting for the taxes and then I'm not taking a risk.

Re: Carmax? I wasted almost 2 hours there 3 years ago when I was buying my Odyssey and trading my Pilot. I followed the advice of using them to get a "back bid" and honestly it was a waste. They came in much much below any reasonable number, so basically I had an "offer" on my car that wasn't really anything I'd take anyway. So in hindsight I wasted a whole Saturday morning for nothing.

So back to the BMW trade in.....what do you guys think is the best strategy.....a full "roadshow" of your car where you tell all 3 dealers that you are going to get the car appraised and take the best overall deal? I sort of like this because it introduces competition to the trade in, and the dealer will have to handicap whether he thinks Dealer 2 or 3 will be willing to take a skinnier margin between their buy price and selling it on the lot. The question is, when you are at dealer 1 and they offer you, say, $7000, do you still walk out saying "I am going to give each dealer a fair shot at this and I need to get the other 2 prices before I tell you whether you won or not" or do dealers at that point just get tired of playing that game. They will say "what number do you need to just close on this today".....the thing is I think it is hard to do what Mick suggested and give them the private party in perfect condition as they will think you don't really know the true value and they will also know that you WILL strike out on that at the other 2 dealers if you are truly saying that you will just sell it yourself unless you hit that price.

So what do you think about this strategy of the "3 dealer road show".....beyond the fact that it will waste a bunch of time going to 3 dealers.....I'm trying to see if anyone can think of an even better strategy for optimizing the trade in number.
 
#46 ·
When I bought the odyssey I took the lowest Odyssey price that I got online and the highest used appraisal that I got from 3 local dealers. I then took that to a 4 dealer and asked if they could match that, that beat it by $100.

Jay
 
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