[CRS-Hybrid]

I’ve been doing some reading on Honda’s oil dilution problem with its direct injection engines. My 2023 Touring was purchased last June and only has 2,500 miles on it. I’ve just returned from a 500 mile trip doing mostly highway miles but otherwise I drive a mix of highway and city. Oil life gauge reads 60%. On returning from the trip, the oil level was right where it should be, but there is definitely the odor of gas in the oil. Is there anyone in this forum with the 2.0 hybrid that doesn’t smell gas in their oil? Or is this oil dilution part of a design flaw in all of the 2.0 Honda direct injection engines?
Thanks
CRS

 

[Bimmer74]

Is there anyone in this forum with the 2.0 hybrid that doesn’t smell gas in their oil?

Mine doesn't. My maintenance minder is still at 40%, and when it hits 15% I'll change the oil and do a UOA.

Also, DI brings with it all kinds of problems (intake valve deposits), but doesn't make fuel contamination of the motor oil any more likely...

 

[PHCH]

All DI and especially DI with turbos have some oil dilution. Honda had an issue with 17-18 CRV'S in cold climates with people doing very short drives. Honda implemented a TSB for some software changes and something with the A/C climate control to fix the issue. Tier 1 fuel along with proper oil changes and your fine.

 

[WiiMaster]

As far as I know most of the major oil dilution issues were on certain 1.5T models. But as mentioned, DI engines will naturally have some amount of it.

 

[PHCH]

Turbos do make a difference. My Hybrid with 1600 miles on it still has clear oil . Can hardly notice it on the stick. My wife's 23 turbo 1.5 CRV after about 2k on the oil its dark.

 

[LARRY70GS]

I have 3600 miles on my Hybrid. It is very difficult to even see the oil on that orange stick. If it had darkened, I'd be able to see it.

 

[PHCH]

What percent does your MM say at 3600?

 

[LARRY70GS]

What percent does your MM say at 3600?

60%

 

[Accord_Mike]

Turbos do make a difference. My Hybrid with 1600 miles on it still has clear oil . Can hardly notice it on the stick. My wife's 23 turbo 1.5 CRV after about 2k on the oil its dark.

The color of the oil is not an indicator of oil dilution because gasoline itself is clear. Also, some additives in modern oils will naturally turn the oil dark over time.

 

[WiiMaster]

The oil in my port injected Accord gets pretty dark too. But like @Accord_Mike says that is pretty much normal. And I got a UOA done that showed fuel dilution wasn't an issue on mine.

 

[TrackRider54]

Modern engines have a tough job. We want performance and reliability, but CAFE standards continue to get more and more strict forcing manufacturers to use thinner oil, piston rings that don't seal as tight, direct injection, and forced induction. It's a recipe for oil dilution. If you are using thinner oil, and you have low friction rings, combined with forced induction...some fuel will get in the oil. The key is to get the oil hot enough that the fuel evaporates out. If you are doing mostly short distances where the engine doesn't get up the temp, then you should be changing the oil and a shorter interval.

I'm still in the shopping phase, so I do not own an Accord hybrid yet, but it's on the top of my list. I like the fact that it has no turbo. It has a direct drive transmission. Of course it has GDI that will require an intake cleaning from time to time and since the engine will be stopped more frequently due to the hybrid system, it is a candidate to get some oil dilution.

When I pull the trigger on one, I will do a UOA at my first oil change to check for dilution. I'll eventually settle on an oil change interval that works best for me. By looking at the underside of the car, it seems to be easy to jack it up and put it on stands, so maintenance should be a breeze.

 

[PHCH]

The color of the oil is not an indicator of oil dilution because gasoline itself is clear. Also, some additives in modern oils will naturally turn the oil dark over time.

I didn't say the color was a indicator of oil dilution. I was stating no matter what oil I use in my 1.5 turbo it gets dark earlier than my non turbo Honda Accord. That's even using amsoil in some cases.

 

[Accord_Mike]

I didn't say the color was a indicator of oil dilution. I was stating no matter what oil I use in my 1.5 turbo it gets dark earlier than my non turbo Honda Accord. That's even using amsoil in some cases.

You stated turbos make a difference in the oil getting dark. If it’s normal for the oil to get dark, then why does having a turbo make a difference? What difference?

On my other car, the oil gets dark and it’s naturally aspirated. The oil getting dark has no significance or difference other than maybe going through a few heat cycles in the engine.

 

[PHCH]

You said it- The turbo direct injected I.5 runs hotter and harder on oil. I think the compression ratio increased for 23. The 2.0 that was refreshed for 23 in the hybrid is also a new design with a high compression ratio but it also has class leading thermal efficiency . Lets get to the point on the engines. The 1.5 is a good engine and is offered in only the lower 2 trims. The 2.0 is a better engine and paired with the hybrid layout. Moving forward it would not surprise me if the 1.5 goes away or they could re work it and pair it with a couple of electric motors. Prelude maybe?

 

[TrackRider54]

You said it- The turbo direct injected I.5 runs hotter and harder on oil. I think the compression ratio increased for 23. The 2.0 that was refreshed for 23 in the hybrid is also a new design with a high compression ratio but it also has class leading thermal efficiency . Lets get to the point on the engines. The 1.5 is a good engine and is offered in only the lower 2 trims. The 2.0 is a better engine and paired with the hybrid layout. Moving forward it would not surprise me if the 1.5 goes away or they could re work it and pair it with a couple of electric motors. Prelude maybe?

I would figure that the 2.0L in the hybrid setup would run an Atkinson cycle which leaves the intake value open during the bottom of the compression stroke thereby lowing compression through a short stroke compression cycle. This lowers pumping losses and allows the engine to be more efficient since it isn't fighting its own compression for the full stroke.

 

[Accord_Mike]

You said it- The turbo direct injected I.5 runs hotter and harder on oil. I think the compression ratio increased for 23. The 2.0 that was refreshed for 23 in the hybrid is also a new design with a high compression ratio but it also has class leading thermal efficiency . Lets get to the point on the engines. The 1.5 is a good engine and is offered in only the lower 2 trims. The 2.0 is a better engine and paired with the hybrid layout. Moving forward it would not surprise me if the 1.5 goes away or they could re work it and pair it with a couple of electric motors. Prelude maybe?

I don’t know if the 2.0 hybrid is the “better” motor per se. Take away the electric motors and the engine only delivers 146hp with a 13.9:1 compression ratio. That’s a fairly high compression ratio for a N/A engine. The smaller 1.5T utilizes F.I. to achieve 192hp without any electric motor assist.

Yeah, you could argue that if you take away the turbo, the 1.5T would be even less. However, you have to take in consideration that the 2.0L has more displacement with a fairly high compression ratio. Either way, I don’t think one engine is significantly better than the other, they’re just different. One engine has a larger displacement, two electric motors and a higher compression ratio to help it along while the other, though slightly smaller in displacement, has F.I.

 

[DrKF]

I don’t know if the 2.0 hybrid is the “better” motor per se. Take away the electric motors and the engine only delivers 146hp with a 13.9:1 compression ratio. That’s a fairly high compression ratio for a N/A engine. The smaller 1.5T utilizes F.I. to achieve 192hp without any electric motor assist.

Yeah, you could argue that if you take away the turbo, the 1.5T would be even less. However, you have to take in consideration that the 2.0L has more displacement with a fairly high compression ratio. Either way, I don’t think one engine is significantly better than the other, they’re just different. One engine has a larger displacement, two electric motors and a higher compression ratio to help it along while the other, though slightly smaller in displacement, has F.I.

So what’s YOUR POINT?

 

[Accord_Mike]

So what’s YOUR POINT?

That the hybrid engine itself is not significantly “better” than the 1.5T.

 

[MisterHooman]

I’ve been doing some reading on Honda’s oil dilution problem with its direct injection engines. My 2023 Touring was purchased last June and only has 2,500 miles on it. I’ve just returned from a 500 mile trip doing mostly highway miles but otherwise I drive a mix of highway and city. Oil life gauge reads 60%. On returning from the trip, the oil level was right where it should be, but there is definitely the odor of gas in the oil. Is there anyone in this forum with the 2.0 hybrid that doesn’t smell gas in their oil? Or is this oil dilution part of a design flaw in all of the 2.0 Honda direct injection engines?
Thanks
CRS

Like @PHCH said, all direct injection engines deal with oil dilution to an extent. Since gas itself is clear, the best way to find gas in your oil as a percentage is an oil analysis using gas chromatography. The only other way is the good 'ole sniffer. Even a little bit of gas in the oil on an oil change will be detected by a good sniffer (aka your nose) because the gas will be in its raw, unburnt, form. But that won't give you specific results.

Because gas thins oil (makes it less viscous), a way to extend an oil change interval is by using a thicker oil. But apparently some on here don't think it's acceptable to put anything in their vehicle besides what Honda wants them to. According to Honda, oil dilution isn't a problem in their vehicles. So, what does that tell you?

Regardless of what Honda says or what anyone says on here, do your own research and come to your own conclusions. That way, you are more educated on the matter and can make an informed decision.

 

[CRS-Hybrid]

Thanks everyone for your replies.
CRS