[Angelja]

As I've gotten used to driving a hybrid, I've found it quite interesting how driving habits seem to impact fuel economy in ways I didn't initially expect. I likely will not change my driving style in the interest of maximizing fuel economy over time, but in the past week or two have paid a bit more attention to check if my 23 touring model is in the expected MPG range. So far it definitely is with my average in the 42-44 range with mixed city and highway miles. But with some caveats ...

If you truly push the car non-stop very aggressively, yes fuel economy suffers and you'll be lucky to be in the 30s especially if you're in a hilly area. No surprise there. But ... on the flip side if you drive the car very conservatively as if you were trying to conserve gas (as I would in any other traditional ICE), fuel economy also seems to suffer. That is, If I gently accelerate to desired speed with light pressure on the accelerator, the engine is on the entire time fueling either the battery or the drive motor, and the direct drive clutch is not engaged until you get to desired speed. Fuel economy suffers this entire time. However, if I accelerate more briskly to desired speed - whether it's 40, 50, 60, 70, whatever - then settle into that speed, the engine turns off and you're EV, or the direct drive clutch engages for higher MPGs. Maybe this is old news for hybrid owners, but I found it quite interesting. And I've found it very useful to use regenerative breaking to both charge the battery and save the brakes. In a few short weeks, driving a different car that doesn't have this feature is suddenly odd! I really like that feature. Regardless, it's been refreshing that in my limited experience more aggressive driving actually seems to yield better MPGs!

Curious if others have noticed this?

 

[123456sp]

Interesting, observation on the slower acceleration and mpg. I have the G10. I read that Honda engineered the G11 to stay in EV mode longer than the G10 but I had wished there would be bigger changes iin the G11 hybrid system but I can only assume they are pushing most resources into full electric vehicle planning...

 

[DrKF]

Interesting, observation on the slower acceleration and mpg. I have the G10. I read that Honda engineered the G11 to stay in EV mode longer than the G10 but I had wished there would be bigger changes iin the G11 hybrid system but I can only assume they are pushing most resources into full electric vehicle planning...

New gas engine, new motors, new management system, 6 levels of regen with the ability to lock a level, improved acceleration and fuel economy-I’m not sure how much more changed the 11G’s hybrid system could get. Make the orange cable yellow?

 

[longhorn]

What is your highway mpg with the hybrid? I do mostly hwy driving in some hills.

My 23 CRV Hybrid does not have an EV only button? What gen is it?

 

[Kryder]

I just bought 2023 Touring Hybrid last week and I came from V8 Dodge Hemi so this is a whole new world for me. I am halfway through my first tank and i am only a tick over 31 mpg and i have been babying it cause i need the mpg to get above 40 to feel better about trading in the Durango. I drive a slightly hilly terrain for 45 min commute each way 4 days a week. How quickly should i get to the 40'ish range? I was only getting 13 city/19 highway (combined 17) with the Durango. I need to at least get double (34 mpg) or i will be disappointed as this car's only purpose for me was to get great mpg. Its not the sexiest car in the world! I also have no clue how or when i should be using those regen paddles (or why). Every other car had paddle shifters up there. Any tips/insight would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Kryder]

I picked mine up Tuesday night (3/14). I've got about 230 miles on my 2023 so far and my average MPG is right at 40. They filled the tank when I purchased it and I've not reset the trip computer so it shows the same mileage as the odometer.

The first 30 miles were other people test driving it so who knows how they drove. 170 miles were me going back and forth on the interstate from my house to the dealership. The remaining 30 miles has been me going back and forth to work usually in busy traffic. I live 4 miles from work but it takes me about 15-20 minutes to get there. I've always driven like an old person so I'm pretty conservative on the gas and brakes. I'm still getting the hang of the paddles for regen braking.

I need to make another 120 mile round trip on the interstate to fight a different dealership for a deposit back and plan on making another 60 mile round trip this weekend to visit my mother and pressure wash her house. I'll report back with how the mileage looks before I do the next fill up. I am going out of town for an extended trip in a week so the car is just going to sit in my garage for a month I'm going to miss it.

damn, im about 10mpg less with a half tank to go......

 

[Splashman24]

I just bought 2023 Touring Hybrid last week and I came from V8 Dodge Hemi so this is a whole new world for me. I am halfway through my first tank and i am only a tick over 31 mpg and i have been babying it cause i need the mpg to get above 40 to feel better about trading in the Durango. I drive a slightly hilly terrain for 45 min commute each way 4 days a week. How quickly should i get to the 40'ish range? I was only getting 13 city/19 highway (combined 17) with the Durango. I need to at least get double (34 mpg) or i will be disappointed as this car's only purpose for me was to get great mpg. Its not the sexiest car in the world! I also have no clue how or when i should be using those regen paddles (or why). Every other car had paddle shifters up there. Any tips/insight would be greatly appreciated.

Kryder, is it cold out where you live? One of the things they don't talk about is how the cold and extreme heat reduces the gas mileage. I have a 2018 HAH that I'm trading in tomorrow. I'm picking up a 2023 Touring in Canyon River Blue. Regarding the paddles use them when braking. Once you start using them to brake you may find that you can control the speed with just your accelerator and the paddles unless you need to come to complete stop.

 

[MrWasabi]

So is MPG better in colder climates or warm?

 

[Splashman24]

So is MPG better in colder climates or warm?

I used to live in Pittsburgh with extremes. The cold lowered gas mileage significantly. Just like it does with electric cars. I now live in Tampa and my mileage is pretty consistent but drops slightly when the temperature is in the 90s.

 

[Kryder]

Kryder, is it cold out where you live? One of the things they don't talk about is how the cold and extreme heat reduces the gas mileage. I have a 2018 HAH that I'm trading in tomorrow. I'm picking up a 2023 Touring in Canyon River Blue. Regarding the paddles use them when braking. Once you start using them to brake you may find that you can control the speed with just your accelerator and the paddles unless you need to come to complete stop.

yeah brother....high 20's low 30's in my neck of the woods right now. I might break down and cry if i dont get close to the 40+ advertised as it broke my heart to trade in my 2022 black Durango but the new job made it less than ideal to drive an hr and a half each day on midgrade fuel which is currently 44 cents per gallon higher than regular gas... what are the benefits to using the paddles for breaking?

 

[Splashman24]

yeah brother....high 20's low 30's in my neck of the woods right now. I might break down and cry if i dont get close to the 40+ advertised as it broke my heart to trade in my 2022 black Durango but the new job made it less than ideal to drive an hr and a half each day on midgrade fuel which is currently 44 cents per gallon higher than regular gas... what are the benefits to using the paddles for breaking?

Three benefits. First it quickly recharges the battery aiding in recouping energy wasted by the friction brakes. Second it, it prolongs the friction brakes as you don't use them as much as you did in your Durango. Third, it engages you more in driving. I like using the paddles. Often in traffic I can slow down and then speed up without ever touching the brake pedal.

 

[Splashman24]

Cajun Touring is probably right about the brake pedal using regen and then friction, i like the control ensuring it's regen with the paddles.

 

[Angelja]

As I mentioned in the first post the gentler I drive the lower the MPGs. (to a point ..
can't drive Ultra aggressive and expect to be in 40s range). Accelerating more rapidly to desired speed increased MPGs in my experience. I'm in 42-43 range consistently mixed highway city. Highway alone seems to dip to 39-40 for me. This is touring with 20" wheels btw. Give it a try and experiment. It's easy to see avg mpg on screen each drive or you can reset trip computer. And yes use regen paddles if you care about efficiency - brakes do some regen but i believe less than paddles.Hope you see improvements!

 

[Kryder]

As I mentioned in the first post the gentler I drive the lower the MPGs. (to a point ..
can't drive Ultra aggressive and expect to be in 40s range). Accelerating more rapidly to desired speed increased MPGs in my experience. I'm in 42-43 range consistently mixed highway city. Highway alone seems to dip to 39-40 for me. This is touring with 20" wheels btw. Give it a try and experiment. It's easy to see avg mpg on screen each drive or you can reset trip computer. And yes use regen paddles if you care about efficiency - brakes do some regen but i believe less than paddles.Hope you see improvements!

Thanks for the input. I was unaware of alot of this info including cold temps negatively impacting mileage. Curious how it will do in the snow. Heck i could have gotten the civic R 300+ horsepower and tons of fun to drive. I think the epa estimates were 38 highway and 28 city but i thought it would be slam dunk mid 40’s on accord as dealer said most people do better than epa listings on the window sticker. Maybe im just bitter about trading in my durango to get a car that had nothing that i loved except the gas mileage. Lol

 

[123456sp]

Kryder, cold (and hot) weather effects the hybrid battery as it does any battery. Optimal conditions for the Honda hybrid is 60-70 degrees, stop and go in town, and not too hiily. Highway driving and cold and hot weather will lower the mpg. As ur car gets some use maybe the battery will improve. Best mpg is the EXL with the 17" wheels like my '18 Touring has. The advertised mpg is using controlled govt quidelines, not all that equal to actually use imo.

I'm waiting to check out the Civic hybrid to be finally sold here later this year. I just a had a gas Civic gas and it's pretty nice, probably nicer than older Accords. I still like my G10 Accord Touring but I never average over 35-40mpg because I commute on highway weekdays. Honda hybrids get less mpg over 65mph but I'm sure your mpg will improve.

 

[123456sp]

To the poster DrKF, I agreed there were changes in the G11 hybrid system, I said I wish they were bigger. Same ICE motor size and battery, tweaked software, regen, maybe a second faster to 60, maybe not; and 1-2 mpg are differences, yes. Look what the new Prius brought over the previous, like 100 more hp. The G11's hybrid system is a tweak; nice, and I'm not saying I won't buy one someday, I just wanted a bigger jump from the 5 y.o. G10 system.

 

[Kryder]

Kryder, cold (and hot) weather effects the hybrid battery as it does any battery. Optimal conditions for the Honda hybrid is 60-70 degrees, stop and go in town, and not too hiily. Highway driving and cold and hot weather will lower the mpg. As ur car gets some use maybe the battery will improve. Best mpg is the EXL with the 17" wheels like my '18 Touring has. The advertised mpg is using controlled govt quidelines, not all that equal to actually use imo.

I'm waiting to check out the Civic hybrid to be finally sold here later this year. I just a had a gas Civic gas and it's pretty nice, probably nicer than older Accords. I still like my G10 Accord Touring but I never average over 35-40mpg because I commute on highway weekdays. Honda hybrids get less mpg over 65mph but I'm sure your mpg will improve.

Thanks for taking the time to explain some of this to me. Unfortunately my 45 min commute is mostly highway and quite hilly. I guess i should have done my research before making an impulse buy based off a window sticker. Although the GM of the dealership is my friend and he also must be unaware of the pros and cons. Next winter i will then be trying out FWD for the first time in decades and i wonder how challenging it will be in snow compared to 4WD or even AWD?

 

[123456sp]

Hope it works out. take some time. I live in the sunbelt so I don't know snow driving, but I can see why people want all wheel drive. Many thought Honda would add it since most others in the segment offer it. But I think Honda wants to keep things simpler and reliable as the Accord has always been. and most people would get a crossover for that..

 

[Kryder]

Hope it works out. take some time. I live in the sunbelt so I don't know snow driving, but I can see why people want all wheel drive. Many thought Honda would add it since most others in the segment offer it. But I think Honda wants to keep things simpler and reliable as the Accord has always been. and most people would get a crossover for that..

Will do!

 

[JeffJo]

Accelerating more rapidly to desired speed increased MPGs in my experience.

Time to pull out my old 10G plots. I know there are minor updates in 11G, but the basic ideas are the same. This is the efficiency map for my 2018 HAH engine:

There is a lot going on here, so let me explain. Engine speed and torque should be self explanatory. Since RPM*TORQUE=POWER, we can determine the power being generated at any point here. Which is the more important number. It is labeled on the right side in horsepower, and follows the gray curves thru the plot. (Sorry for the mixed systems of measurement.)

The colors in the center indicate how much gas is used to make that power. The best is 208.1 grams for each kiloWatt-hour, which is 40.6% efficiency. It happens at 2000 RPM (or 54 mph in Engine Drive) and 34 HP. This is where we would like the engine to operate all the time. The blue line represents the best efficiency at each RPM value.

The disadvantage of gasoline cars is that, for the car to have enough power for acceleration, this "sweet spot" has to be in between the power needed to maintain speed on a flat road, and the power needed for acceleration. Cruising power is shown by the black dotted line, for the gear ratio we have in Engine Drive. A conventional car, with a shiftable transmission, would move that line right or left so that it crosses the blue line near the power requirement.

And that's the problem. To cruise at 45 mph, the black line says that our car needs a little under 10 HP. That crosses the blue line (the last blue dot on the left) at about 230 g/kWh, or 35% efficiency. In a gas-only car, this would be lower since the engine has to be bigger. It would operate at about 30% efficiency. I'll return to this number.

But in our hybrid, the system will move along the blue line to one of the purple dots, as indicated by the yellow arrow. The extra power generated will be used to charge the battery. This will be used later, either in EV Drive or to move back to the purple dots (from either the right-side blue dots of the higher yellow dots). That will also improve efficiency. The down-side, is that using the battery to save, and recover, this extra energy has maybe a 25% loss. So, while the power you use directly is 40% efficient, the power you use indirectly is 30% efficient. I've gone on too long, but the yellow dots do something similar in Engine Drive.

And this finally gets to your implies question. When accelerating, the absolute best thing to do is to accelerate at a rate where you are neither charging, or discharging, the battery. This way, you get it all at 40% efficiency, and none at 30%. I've never tried to watch that, but my guess is that you come close to it with what you describe. But it can only apply easily at the slower ranges of speed.

And yes use regen paddles if you care about efficiency - brakes do some regen but i believe less than paddles.Hope you see improvements!

They do the same thing. When you press the brake pedal, the computer uses what is called "blended braking." It will apply as much regen braking as is both possible and safe, then add friction braking. If you use just the paddles, the system relies on you to determine when to add the friction brakes. You can train yourself for how much room is needed to slow down most efficiently with the paddles; but once you master that, the pedals are just as efficient. (I really do feel like Dr. Seuss when I talks about pressing pedals vs. pulling paddles.)

It sounds to me like you're just doing the "pulse and glide" technique which will give you better fuel efficiency in a hybrid. It's not very good for people around you though as you're constantly speeding up to go over the speed limit, then coasting down under the speed limit, and repeating.

Pulse-and-glide is essentially doing the same thing as moving the dots around as I described above. The exception is that our hybrid, unllike some others, does not have to speed up and slow down to accomplish it.